Earnings Labs

AIFU Inc. (AIFU)

Q3 2012 Earnings Call· Fri, Nov 30, 2012

$1.37

+7.87%

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Transcript

Operator

Operator

Thank you for standing by for CNinsure's 2012 Q3 3arnings conference call. At this time all participants are in a listen-only mode. All lines have been placed on mute to prevent background noise. After the management's prepared remarks there will be a question and answer section. [Operator instructions]. For your information, this conference call is now being broadcasted live over the internet. Webcast replay will be available within two hours after the conference is finished. Please visit CNinsure's IR website at ir.cninsure.net, under the Events & Webcasts section. Today's conference is being recorded. If you have any objections, you may disconnect at any time. I would now like to turn the meeting over to your host for today's conference, Ms. Oasis Qui, CNinsure's Investor Relations Officer. Thank you. Please go ahead.

Oasis Qiu

Analyst

Good morning. Welcome to our third quarter 2012 earnings conference call. The earnings results were released earlier today and are available on our IR website as well as on Newswire. Before we continue, please note that the discussion today will contain forward-looking statements made under the Safe Harbor provisions of the US Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. The accuracy of these statements may be impacted by a number of business risks and uncertainties that could cause our actual results to differ materially from those projected or anticipated. Such risks and uncertainties include but are not limited to those outlined in our filings with the SEC, including our registration statement on Form 20-F. We do not undertake any obligation to update this forward-looking information except as required under applicable law. Joining us today is our Chief Executive Officer, Mr. Chunlin Wang, and Chief Financial Officer, Mr. Peng Ge. Mr. Wang will walk you through our third quarter 2012 financial and operating results and discuss the progress of our strategic transition. Mr. Wang and Mr. Ge will then take your questions after the prepared remarks. Now I will turn the call over to Mr. Wang.

Chunlin Wang

Analyst

[Interpreted]. Hello, everyone. Thank you for joining us on today's conference call. I will begin today's call with a review of our third quarter 2012 financial and operating performance, followed by an update on the progress of our strategic transition. Then Mr. Peng Ge, our CFO, and I will go into the Q&A session. During the first nine months of 2012, China's insurance industry remained in the single-digit growth territory. Despite the challenging market environment, however, we are pleased to see that our total net revenues for third quarter 2012 grew 5% year over year, beating our previous guidance of flat growth. Looking at our three major business lines, Property & Casualty Insurance segment recorded 7% revenue growth year on year in the third quarter. But intensified competition forced us to increase commissions to our sales agents, which resulted in significant drop of our gross margin and weighted heavily upon our bottom line. Life Insurance segment, impacted by subdued sales in insurance industry, witnessed a decline in net revenues in the third quarter, but we're encouraged to see that the recurring life insurance premiums that were distributed continued strong growth momentum into the third quarter with a year-on-year growth of 30%, mainly attributable to long-term effect of life insurance business and high 13-month persistency ratio of over 81%. The growth of our claims adjusting business remained stable in the third quarter 2012, with net revenues increasing 7.9% from the year-ago quarter. Since I took over as CNinsure's CEO last October, I had been navigating the company through a transition and adjustment period during which we rolled out the following initiatives to push forward the strategic transition. I'm pleased that the transition plan has progressed in line with our expectation. Firstly, we had been simplifying our organizational structure in order to…

Operator

Operator

We would now begin our question-and-answer session. [Operator Instructions]. Your first question today comes from the line of Mike Ryan from MJR Capital. Mike, please go ahead. Mike Ryan – MJR Capital: Hi. Thanks for taking my call this evening. My first question as it relates to commissions and fees and how that's trended over the year as a percentage of revenue, and particularly in the current quarter, whether there was any sort of unusual items included in that given the close-down of some of the sales outlets.

Oasis Qui

Analyst

[Chinese language spoken] And second part of the question? Mike Ryan – MJR Capital: The second part of the question is, what are -- I mean, the current level of commission and fees as a percentage of revenue seems to be untenable. What are we doing to fix that? I understand that what you're saying is that we've -- it kind of plateaued, but what are we doing to drive that down?

Oasis Qui

Analyst

[Chinese language spoken]

Peng Ge

Analyst

[Chinese language spoken]

Oasis Qui

Analyst

Our CFO would like to take your question. The commission rate we received for the third quarter 2012 was 23% as compared to 19% last year for the P&C business.

Chunlin Wang

Analyst

[Chinese language spoken]

Oasis Qui

Analyst

CEO would like to answer your second part of the question. As we mentioned, that the commission that we pay to our sales agents has reached a very high level and we believe the highest level in this quarter, in the third quarter. But we believe that the gross margin has already hit the bottom in the third quarter. And the way for us to drive the commission cost down is to -- by development or distribution of the impact or the sales support divide.

Chunlin Wang

Analyst

[Chinese language spoken]

Oasis Qui

Analyst

Yes. Mike Ryan – MJR Capital: I was just going to ask, where do you see the operating margins going? Will we ever get back to 30% operating margins, or where do you see them heading based on where sales commissions will end up going?

Oasis Qui

Analyst

[Chinese language spoken]

Chunlin Wang

Analyst

[Chinese language spoken]

Oasis Qui

Analyst

Based on the third quarter's results, our gross margin for the third quarter was like 27% to 28%, and the expense ratio is roughly 25% to 26%. So that means the operating margin was down only 2% to 3%. Based on our experience and the trends, what we have experienced in the past decade, we believe that the commission level, the commission cost is at the highest level and now our gross margin has reached the lowest level, and we don't think that our operating margin will go down any further. Mike Ryan – MJR Capital: I guess what I'm trying to get a better understanding of is how long do you think we'll be at the higher level of the commission expense and when do you think that will start trending -- and maybe you could give a little high-level color why somebody comes to work as an insurer. Is it solely based on the commissions that they're going to receive or is there some value in being able to, you know, for a wide variety of products from different carriers, value in the systems you have? Maybe talk some more about why sales agents come to CNinsure. Maybe that can help in the answer to where commissions might go.

Oasis Qui

Analyst

[Chinese language spoken]

Chunlin Wang

Analyst

[Chinese language spoken]

Oasis Qui

Analyst

So, first of all, from the market perspective, we have seen very fierce competition among property and casualty insurance companies, and we believe that it has reached the most severe level that we have ever seen. And as a result of that, we expect that half of the property and casualty insurance companies may report a loss this year. So the likelihood for them to further increase the commissions paid out is very low. So that's why we don't think the commission costs will continue to go up. And secondly, for CNinsure, we have launched the CNpad and we expect to distribute 50,000 to 100,000 units of this CNpad to sales agents. And because the CNpad actually is very powerful tool for -- to help agents to improve their efficiency, reduce the operating costs and also diversify their revenue sources, so that also help reduce the commission rate that we're going to pay to our sales agents.

Chunlin Wang

Analyst

[Chinese language spoken]

Oasis Qui

Analyst

And the reason that sales agents may choose to join CNinsure is furthermore we have wider range of product offerings and we represent multiple insurance companies, and we also help them to better -- provide better services to their clients. Mike Ryan – MJR Capital: Great. Thanks a lot. I appreciate your time, and I'll let somebody else ask a question.

Oasis Qui

Analyst

Thank you.