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Acuity Brands, Inc. (AYI)

Q3 2016 Earnings Call· Wed, Jun 29, 2016

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Transcript

Operator

Operator

Good morning, and welcome to Acuity Brands Fiscal 2016 Third Quarter Financial Conference Call. After today's presentation, there will be a formal question-and-answer session. [Operator Instructions] Today's conference is being recorded. If you have any objections, you may disconnect at this time. Now, I would like to introduce Mr. Dan Smith, Senior Vice President, Treasurer and Secretary. Sir, you may begin.

Dan Smith

Analyst

Hello, good morning. With me today to discuss our third quarter results are Vern Nagel, our Chairman, President and Chief Executive Officer; and Ricky Reece, our Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer. We are webcasting today's conference call at acuitybrands.com. I would like to remind everyone that during this call, we may make projections or forward-looking statements regarding future events or future financial performance of the Company. Such statements involve risks and uncertainties such that actual results may differ materially. Please refer to our most recent 10-K and 10-Q SEC filings in today's press release, which identify important factors that could cause actual results to differ materially from those contained in our projections or forward-looking statements. Now let me turn this call over to Vern Nagel.

Vernon Nagel

Analyst

Thank you, Dan. Good morning, everyone. Ricky and I would like to make a few comments and then we will be happy to answer your questions. First off, our results for the third quarter of 2016 were outstanding. Our net sales grew 25% while our adjusted diluted earnings per share grew 40%. We achieved record quarterly results for a number of key financial metrics including net sales and gross profit margin and on an adjusted basis operating profit and diluted earnings per share. In fact this was our 13th quarter in a row where we achieved double digit volume growth, a remarkable achievement. We believe these results are yet again strong evidence of our strategies to provide our customers with differentiated value-added solutions and to diversify the end-markets we serve are succeeding, allowing us to extend our leadership position. These strategies include accretive acquisitions, the continued aggressive introduction of innovative, energy-efficient lighting and building automation solutions, expansion in key channels and geographies, improvements in customer service and company-wide productivity gains. Our results for the third quarter set records for Acuity even as we continue to invest in our strong sales growth in the areas with significant growth potential including the expansion of our solid state luminaire and lighting controls portfolio, as well as our building automation and Internet-of-Things solution. I know many of you have already seen our results and Ricky will provide more details later in the call but I would like to make a few comments on the key highlights for the quarter. Net sales for the third quarter were $852 million, an increase of 25% compared with a year ago period, and the highest quarterly sales in our history. Reported operating profit for the third quarter of 2016 was $121 million compared with reported operating profit of…

Richard Reece

Analyst

Thank you, Vern and good morning everyone. As Vern noted we had a strong third quarter performance on virtually all metrics including sales and earnings growth, profitability and cash flow. I will provide a bit more color on our record third quarter results and our financial position. As Vern mentioned earlier we had some adjustments to the GAAP results in the third quarter of fiscal 2016 and 2015 which we find useful to add back in order for the quarterly results to be comparable. In the third quarter of fiscal year 2016 we added back $1 million or $0.02 per diluted share for various acquisition related items. $7.5 million or $0.11 per diluted share for the amortization of acquired intangible assets. $6.9 million or $0.10 per diluted share for share based compensation expense and $9.7 million or $0.14 per diluted share for special charges related to streamlining activities including integration of recent acquisitions and consolidation of certain production activities. We adjusted prior year results for amortizations for acquired intangible assets of $2.8 million of $0.04 per diluted share, share based compensation expense of $4.4 million or $0.06 per diluted share acquisition related items of $1.3 million or $0.03 per diluted share and special charge of $0.4 million or $0.01 per diluted share. In addition we adjusted prior year’s results for the gain on financial instruments used to hedged the deistic Canadian dollar purchase price of $10.5 million or $0.15 per diluted share. These adjustments to our GAAP earnings resulted in an adjusted diluted EPS of $2.06 for the third quarter of fiscal year 2016 which is a 40% increase compared with the $1.47 adjusted diluted EPS in the year ago period. We believe these non-GAAP measures provide greater comparability and enhanced visibility into our results of operations. We thank you…

Vernon Nagel

Analyst

Thank you, Ricky. As we look forward, we see significant long-term growth opportunities that are ever-changing and evolving in a positive direction for Acuity. Last week’s UK referendum with European Union has created a great deal of uncertainty and generated significant volatility in the global financial markets over concerns regarding the potential impact if any on the global economy. This uncertainty and volatility have the potential to affect consumer and business sentiment which could negatively impact global economic activity. This notwithstanding we remain bullish regarding the company’s prospects for continued profitable growth. So while we don’t give earnings guidance, I would like to provide a few observations. First the consensus estimate from independent third-party forecasters calls for the broad lighting market in North America which represents 97% of our total net sales to grow to mid to upper single digit range through fiscal 2016 reflecting the benefits of both new construction and renovation activity. Again the favorable trend in our June order rate seems to support this continued levels of improvement, further we continue to see signs that give us optimism regarding the future growth of the markets we serve in our business. Leading indicators for the North American markets such as architecture billing index, vacancy rates, office absorption, lending availability and favorable employment trends continue to improve at varying paces, while residential construction continues to grow nicely. Excluding the price of certain LED components which are expected to continue to decline and steel costs, which have risen recently, we do not anticipate significant changes in most input costs over the next 12 months. We expect to offset the impact of rising steel prices through certain pricing initiatives and product cost reductions further we expect employee related cost to continue to rise primarily due to increases in associate headcount, wage…

Operator

Operator

[Operator Instructions] The first question is from John Walsh with Vertical Research.

John Walsh

Analyst

Hi, good morning. I was wondering if you could talk a little bit about the acquisition pipeline and then kind of wondering also about some of the volatility we are seeing in Europe, if that kind of opens an opportunity to do something there or if you feel you need to wait for the market to normalize a bit before you would do anything in that market?

Vernon Nagel

Analyst

So Ricky why don't I take the second part first and then you comment on acquisition. Our strategy in broad Europe is really two-fold. We have a very strong brand in both industrial and Roadway, as well as other types of indoor capabilities. So we will continue to drive our productivity, our focus in those markets with those products. We focus on U.K., we focus on Germany, Northern Europe. We have our capability in Spain and my senses is that, while there is great deal of uncertainty going on right on, which could have some impact on our order rate, we still think it’s a bullish opportunity because of what certain markets and certain countries are doing in terms of their industrial output. So while Europe represents or sales outside of North America represent really only 3% of our total we continue to like the strategy that we have in Europe and that is to focus on key customer sets, key channels with key products that we have and maintain our capability there. If there are opportunities that come up we’ll look at them but they have to be very consistent with our strategy. In terms of acquisitions overall, we continue to see a very interesting pipeline and Ricky why don't I ask you to comment on that.

Richard Reece

Analyst

Yes, we continue as Vern said to see a very robust opportunity for acquisitions. Our focus is in two primary areas technology and there we continue to see opportunities not only to acquire but to make investments in minority or larger investments in or to partner or lastly to just have a commercial relationship to share technology on a licensing type arrangements. So we do see a lot of opportunities there and continue to be very active in pursuing opportunities to expand our capability and technology. The other areas in bolt-on tuck-in type acquisitions both for our luminaire business as well as our Control Building Management business. There too we’re seeing a robust pipeline obviously Juno is a great example of bolt-on, tuck-in type acquisition that fills gaps that we have. There we are more likely obviously look to acquire as opposed to invest in but we do see a robust pipeline and I think it’s likely in both of those areas to continue to see SP active where it supports our strategic focus and creates a value at a reasonable price.

Vernon Nagel

Analyst

And as everyone knows, we are very disciplined in terms of the acquisitions that we make. Transactions have to be both desirable as well as doable from a financial perspective. So it’s difficult to precisely determine the exact timing of acquisitions. But suffice it to say that it’s part of our strategy for growth. We will continue to look for these types of opportunities as Ricky described.

John Walsh

Analyst

Okay. And then just on the second question, are there any metric that you can share about driving the Tier 3, Tier 4 solutions growth either the amount of headcount that has been added to sales and engineering this year and kind of expectations in the next year, how you’re going to drive that initiative?

Vernon Nagel

Analyst

Sure. In my prepared remarks I said that Tier 3 solutions through the first three months and again it’s coming off of a smaller base and our measuring capabilities in the prior periods weren’t as robust as they are today but we guesstimate that Tier 3 portion of our business which now represents almost 10% of our business grew at approximately 40% growth rate. When we think about how we have invested in our tiered solutions strategy in our headcount including acquisitions this year is probably up and their salaried headcount area close to 30%. And while we don’t specifically allocate all capabilities by tiers because of the way products can work and migrate through the tiers and support the tiers it’s not really an effective use to allocate. But what I can say is that when we look at things specific to our tiered solutions strategy like our ability to develop software whether it’d be firmware that makes our entire Tier 3 solutions work well between various control components Distech of course and in our lighting business that group has expanded by a factor of four. We probably had 18 months ago less than 20 folks in this group today we have over while we are approaching 80 folks. And by the end of the year we will probably have close to 100 on our way probably to 150 people. And it’s really because of the opportunities that we see in supporting the Tier 3, Tier 4 solution set. We are very pleased to announce that Target selected us as their exclusive Smart Lighting Solutions provider. The opportunity to provide them not only with lighting solutions that enhance energy efficiency but provide them with other opportunities to do things is really – I think it’s the ample of how we’re moving but investing in and growing our Tier 3 solution strategy. So more to come there into very early innings of this game and we are very excited about the potential of what this tiered solutions strategy will afford for U.S. shareholders and for our customers as solutions.

John Walsh

Analyst

Great, thank you for the color.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from Tim Weiss with Baird.

Tim Weiss

Analyst

Hi guys, good morning, nice job. I guess just going back to Target, is there any way to maybe kind of put some numbers around just the revenue opportunity? I think you said that the number of beacon enabled light fixtures is going to quadruple by the end of the year and just maybe some rough math, that could add a couple of points to revenue growth. So just want to make sure that maybe I'm in the ballpark in terms of how we should think about the Target win financially?

Vernon Nagel

Analyst

Well, I mean as you might imagine the opportunity of Target, the initial opportunity is somewhat I mean interesting in that they will build out, I think the number is probably north of 300 stores over the next three or four months. I think what's more interesting in trying to put a numerical number around it, and it's not just target, it's the whole notion of how the installed base not just in retail, but when you think about other very large building owners whether it's campuses or universities or research centers, these large installed base is the opportunity to convert them from traditional lighting to smart lighting solutions really is not only for energy savings, but daylight harvesting, the ability to make the visual space better more effective, the opportunity to participate in the Internet of Things as data collection points that's what we find really fascinating. So, our relationship with Target is a decades or long relationship. There are great customer and we dedicate significant resources to making sure that we are meeting their needs at every step. So it's an example of our access to market and then bringing these solutions that to the market that are allowing us to drive two or three. So when I think about the total market, DOE says that there's 100 billion square feet of building space that is in U.S. 70% of which was put in place before 1990. Few years ago, we estimated that to convert that installed base might have been about $3 a square foot for lighting and controls. Today we believe that number is much higher, because of the true value add that can be brought through the smart life and the target situation is just an example. And there are many, many, many more. So without focusing too much on target but focusing more on what target represents as a leader in the retail space and taking a leadership position to make the conversion to smart lighting. I think that's what's really interesting. And then how that expands and extends to other folks that are different subsets of the retail market, which as you know is huge, so that they can take advantage of smart lighting. That's the potential. I think that the market that’s out there that installed base is enormous in size and represents an enormous opportunity for Acuity as we go forward.

Tim Weiss

Analyst

That is great. Would you say that over the last maybe even year to date that the number of conversations that you are having with retailers is starting to accelerate?

Vernon Nagel

Analyst

Absolutely, and it's not just retailers, it's users of space that are looking to optimize how they use based, not just from an energy saving standpoint, but how can quality of life enhance what they're doing. How can these luminaries that can be enabled in a much more effective way. Today and you still have technologies that are out there that are using battery powered beacons and somehow they're trying to say that that is the equivalent. It's really a shame because those that that old technology those old solutions that people are saying well I have that too. It's really not the same. And as people become more comfortable and I understand the solutions that what Acuity offers is really huge, the introduction of nLight Eclipse for example. But just another example of a Tier 3 solutions that allows us to get after building owners not just retailers but all building owners in a way that allows us to optimize their lighting while driving great unification between the HVAC systems, sub-metering, security and lighting and allowing us to do this in a very, very clever and simple way. It doesn’t exist in the marketplace so we’re excited about that whole approach to the installed base because of its size and scale.

Tim Weiss

Analyst

Okay. And then just my second question, just on the restructuring and the streamlining expenses that you called out, should we think of that as incremental to the mid to high 20% incremental margin target that you have out there or is it kind of included in that target over the next year?

Vernon Nagel

Analyst

The opportunities that we have to continue to direct investment in our business we're looking for ways to continue to own how we approach the market. The investments that we make and some of those are difficult decisions of what we are not going to because they are still some market but we see so much potential and again Tier 3 and Tier 4 it what can mean for that install base. We will continue to direct investment and continue to drive productivity in our business and I’ll consider this productivity opportunity where we can continue to invest. This quarter we delivered on the legacy business about 30% variable contribution. So its higher than what we kind of have been targeting into that mid to upper 20s, so, we’re always looking to optimize in the short term what we are doing in terms of variable contribution margin so, we can drive our results but we are doing that against the back drop of long term investment opportunities. And for us mostly that's human capital. We’re spending right now on CapEx about 2.5% of sales little bit higher than what we normally do but we're still investing at a very rapid pace in our human talent as I mentioned earlier in putting acquisitions or salary headcounts up about 30% but interestingly our SD&A as a percentage of total sales we picked up about 10 bips. So we’re looking to leverage our base while investing, so to say precisely that all of those savings are going to enhance variable contribution we're looking at balancing of investing for the short term as well as driving - investing for the longer term while investing our delivery shorter term as well

Tim Weiss

Analyst

Great, keep up the good work and good luck.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from Sven Eenmaa with Stifel.

Sven Eenmaa

Analyst

Thanks for taking my questions. First I wanted to ask in terms of your sales in today new construction and renovation market. What kind of growth rates are you seeing in new construction versus renovation side and are there any verticals in the market which you see accelerating or decelerating currently?

Vernon Nagel

Analyst

Sure. Overall we believe that our mix of business is tilted - we have estimated 50% renovation, 50% new construction, it’s probably tilting a little bit more towards renovation and I would see that over time, it may even tilt more because the installed base is so enormous and the opportunity there is to provide value solution sets and customers where there is no alternative, they’re not building something they’re not renovating, we call that unplanned renovation but it’s because the payback and the opportunity of the new solution set is so compelling that they want to make that unplanned renovation. I would say new construction continues to move along at a solid but yet somewhat of almost schizophrenic pace. We see spurts and then we see declines, we see spurts and declines and that has to do with the entire geography because we served so many different markets, it’s difficult to discern an absolute trend. There is no doubt that when we went through here over the last 18 months changes in oil prices that's some of the activities and those oil patch areas slowed down a little bit but yet in other areas of technology, we see those markets continuing to expand. So I feel generally speaking that as employment continues to improve, we’re seeing broad based improvement in commercial office buildings, we're seeing improvements in healthcare as budgets of states continue to improve, we are seeing spending on education both K through 12 as well as higher education, the industrial segment continues to move along nicely, roadway seems to be moving along quite nicely. So I think all in all, we are continuing to see improvement on a gradual basis but it’s the - it’s the renovation market that allows us to continue to drive our growth in a solid way. Europe, we will wait and see what happens there. Obviously that uncertainty is out there but I don’t feel like that contagion of anything that may go on there will spill over here. And just to reiterate, 97% of our revenues are generated here. We have a great business in the U.K. and in Spain. Obviously U.K.'s products just got a heck of a lot cheaper for people to now acquire them and mainly in Europe. So we continue to be bullish on the overall opportunities for Acuity.

Sven Eenmaa

Analyst

Great to hear. The second question I wanted to ask was regarding your integrated solution which now you can provide both the Distech acquisition including lighting controls and HVAC and obviously you mentioned security as well. There are obviously already established competitors in those markets but curious to understand like which verticals or which market segments do you see for US, kind of the lowest hanging fruit or where do you expect to make the fastest headway there?

Vernon Nagel

Analyst

Sure. So if you look at Distech, and Distech is a technology control company and so it’s not really selling hardware components. So when you move or remove that and you look at people who are selling software control solutions Distech has while it’s a smaller business it has a very strong reputation for being innovative using technology and it has a reasonable market share. And so the opportunity for us to work with and have two channels, there are traditional channel system integrators and our traditional channel of local agents work together to sell these solution set that really provide a great deal of value for really buildings of all types. And really explain why using our now Unified system which we’re very excited about. It’s software it took a lot of time to develop a lot of hard work but the nLight Eclipse System will be the backbone in terms of creating a very, very simple piece of glass for building users to now manage the affairs of their building in a much more simple and effective way. So we’re very excited about the possibilities and the opportunities of that because it’s applicability again think of education campuses of any type, commercial office buildings, healthcare facilities and you can just keep going on buildings of any type are really the opportunity here. And given the connectivity that we have through contractors, engineers, lighting designers and they through system integrators and then their own form of contractors this will allow us to sell those value proposition. And the ease of installation, the ease of programming is really going to be a point of key differentiation and then the end user has again very, very simple tools or simple to use but massive tools that are available to help drive the effectiveness of their building.

Sven Eenmaa

Analyst

Great, thank you.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. And the next question is from Jeff Osborne with Cowen & Company.

Jeff Osborne

Analyst

Hi, good morning and congratulations on the results. I just had two quick questions. One, on the 2% price mix; that is a little higher than recent quarters. You had alluded to on the call that the driver of that was the LED component and other component price declines, but I just wanted to get a sense of was there a pickup there or was your reductions in price somewhat of a catch-up or where there competitive aspects at play? Any color would be helpful.

Richard Reece

Analyst

Yes, I would say it’s a slight pick-up we’ve been saying 1% so it’s a slight pick-up with around – we have seen kind of a trough in not just LED components which is the primary driver of that but still in other areas that kind of hit a trough and there’s a little bit of lag and when that gets in pricing that I think impacted that. It’s those kinds of cost reductions in commodity such as steel, aluminum. Copper do get past on pretty quickly in our industry. Now as many of you know steel has taken a quick V turn not even a U turn, the V turn based on the tariffs that have been imposed on steel to where we’ve seen steel rise 35 something percent here in the last few months. So I - it will be interesting to see how quick the market reacts to passing that on. Historically they have been -- the industry has passed that on. But I would say it’s still predominantly due to passing on reduction in our input cost predominantly LED but we have seen some reduction in others that it cause that number to round to 2% instead of the 1%.

Jeff Osborne

Analyst

Got it. Thanks for that, Ricky. Then, Vern, for you. You mentioned target over the next three to four months roughly 300 stores. I think you also in your prepared remarks alluded to two other retailers, which I imagine you are limited in what you can -- at least naming them, but can you just give us a sense of scope? Is the timeframe for rollout a similar timeframe, as well as scope and size of the number of stores?

Vernon Nagel

Analyst

Again we are working with multiple end customers and multiple different verticals and we don’t have specific date. But my too sense is that based on the question that we had earlier the activity in the interest level is increasing at a very high rate. And our ability to position ourselves and to have dialogue with these various end customers is robust. And you know, retailers are very, very focused on the quality of lighting their store. They are very focused on energy savings. They are very focused on these types of things. So the transition from conventional for us in lighting into LED while it’s very interesting they are doing it because they see multiple opportunities around it. I mentioned target only by way of example and when you think about the installed base and I want to keep bringing this back to that. It is so be enormous in terms of the potential for conversion that this was where our excitement is. It’s not - for the investing public you guys the several give us some evidence that the Tier 3 solutions that their strategy can work. Our growth there is being quite significant as a percentage of our sales. It’s now becoming significant. This was a customer that made a move. It’s just a – it’s a continuation of the margin towards the huge opportunities that’s out there. So you are right. I’m not going to mention other names but I want to make sure investors understand is that the opportunity through all of these verticals is quite enormous. And so we are looking at all those verticals and we’re attacking them as we have with bigger and we are selling the solutions as we believe that we have great sales forces that know how to sell…

Jeff Osborne

Analyst

Perfect. Thanks so much.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from Brian Lee with Goldman Sachs.

Brian Lee

Analyst

Hi, guys. Thanks for taking the questions. First one was on pricing, it does seem like ASP declines have been more moderate than a lot of people have been expecting particularly on the LED side given the component declines we have seen. So just wondering does this have to do with your product mix simply getting better as part of the tiered strategy and masking the blended ASP declines or are there some other drivers behind this? And can you also comment on what the sustainability of the trend is medium and longer-term in your view?

Vernon Nagel

Analyst

I think Acuity has done a very good job for a long time of really focusing on continuous improvement driving productivity gains throughout the business. We just simply because pricing of componentry comes down as Ricky pointed out earlier, it can find its way back into the market. We deal on a bid world but we’re all trying to or at least Acuity is trying to differentiate its features and benefits relative to the price and I think we have been successful in convincing our customers of the true value of the solution set that we bring. Again when we are up against competitors that are bringing battery powered beacons to the marketplace that's old news, people who are installing that type of technology are making a huge mistake, it's almost irresponsible for them to do that. The fact of the matter is that Acuity continues to drive that productivity, drive the change in its value proposition so that it can continue to extract the value of our gross profit margin if you will for that value. I expect that the trend to continue. We tend to look at gross profit over a annual period, not quarterly period, I know that you all have to look at everything on a quarterly basis but I think if you look at that type of thing over an annual basis, you’ll see that continuous improvement in our business is allowing us to improve margins volume as that increases we’re able to extract that variable contribution mix as we continue to grow Tier 3. But let’s be clear Tier 1 and Tier 2 are critically important and we do well there as well in terms of margin profile but there is no doubt that Tier 3 and Tier 4 have gross profit margin dynamics that are accretive to what we’re doing today. So we would expect to see that trend continue. Even the pricing as Ricky pointed out earlier on component cost, that's ebbing and flowing, it's something that we’ve always had to manage. What’s more important about it is you can continue to have improvements even incremental improvements in technology and that goes back into the florescent world. Just imagine when it went from T12 to T08 to T05 same scenario. So simply because it’s an LED light source, it hasn’t really changed how we think about the internal workings of our business and how we compete in the marketplace, we are always trying to sell value, the new technology, LED is an enabler for us to selling more value, i.e. Internet of Things, combined solutions stats for energy savings, that's how we are driving the value and I expect the trend to continue.

Brian Lee

Analyst

Great, that is super helpful. Second question was just on the market itself. Recently the DOE released some LED penetration statistics for the U.S. lighting market for 2015. If you look at the data it looks like resi has been slower than expected, both commercial and industrial has been tracking better and then outdoor was most penetrated at I think a bit over 20%. So wondering how do those trends compare to what you are seeing in your business? And then on outdoor specifically, I know there has been a lot of talk about the retail channel and building automation but can you give us some sense of whether the higher penetration in that particular vertical is expected to lead to more moderate growth and then what your exposure is there specifically versus some of the other end market categories? Thank you.

Vernon Nagel

Analyst

Sure. I can only comment on our outdoor business and that continues to grow at a very nice pace. So we are actually gaining share nicely there, our growth rates are exceeding the overall growth rates of the market. The reason for the penetration in outdoor it's a total cost of ownership type thing, the whole notion of whether it’s an industrial outdoor or whether it’s a street or roadway, these luminaires are very expensive to have to change light bulbs and maintain. So LED is a perfect opportunity to bring value there. So the penetration rate of outdoor makes complete sense to me and I expect that to continue but let me remind everyone, it’s still only 20%, there is another 80% that is out there and that 80% market continues to by itself just an outdoor to be an enormous market by itself. In other areas of the business, we are very excited about the introduction of nLight Eclipse and other components off of that, the ability to we will have some more comments on this later for the ability to separate meter. We believe it's going to allow Acuity with this lighting solutions, building automation solutions that get after that commercial office market, the installed base which is converted very, very slowly. Primarily because most commercial buildings are socialized utilities, so it's hard to actually get down to what are you consuming in terms of energy, you just pay it based on square footage. So we're very excited about the potential of converting to that type of market as we go forward. Ricky, other end markets I would say, we see again continued opportunities for further penetration, I think that the notion of what retail is doing, retail is looking at not just energy savings, but what more can occur there that's a big space.

Richard Reece

Analyst

And I would just acknowledge the obvious that it's wherever it was more an incandescent light source in the commercial world that it's converting much more quickly than the fluorescent when you get in and as you mention indoors converting slower offices that have fluorescent, if you've upgraded to high upper T8 or T5 that's still a very energy efficient light source, so their conversion is slower, but you are now seeing LED pulling away from the lumens per watt and the capability of fluorescent. So I do think it will accelerate there, we're very well penetrated in that indoor space, and would expect fully participate is that conversion accelerates about where it's been the fastest today is more where you've had energy sources that were less energy efficient incandescent and high pressure sodium HID that had issues not just energy, but slow to come on hard to control, those type of things that are driving this conversion.

Vernon Nagel

Analyst

And lastly in the retail side I believe that folks early on found replacements to be expensive. I think that their level of satisfaction with them was not as robust, I think more and more folks are finding that replacement kits are a more effective way to do things within their home, they work better, they meet the specifications of long life that they're supposed to. If you put a bulb in a can that wasn't made to handle that kind of bulb, chances are you're going to get significantly less life then what the manufacturer may advertise. So we don't sell bulbs, but we obviously create kits that are very cost effective, and very, very efficient, that portion of our business continues to grow very nicely. So, I believe this conversion whether it happens 5 years, 10 years, 15 years or 20 years, is just a huge, huge market and an opportunity for significant growth overtime.

Brian Lee

Analyst

Great, thanks guys.

Operator

Operator

Thank you. I would like to turn the call back over to Mr. Vernon Nagel for closing remarks.

Vernon Nagel

Analyst

Thank you for your time this morning. We strongly believe we are focusing on the right objective deploying the proper strategies and driving the organization to succeed in critical areas that will over the longer term continue to deliver strong returns to our key stakeholders. Our future is very bright and we thank you for your support. Thank you.

Operator

Operator

And that concludes today's call. Thank you for your participation. You may now disconnect.