Earnings Labs

Cosan S.A. (CSAN)

Q4 2014 Earnings Call· Thu, Mar 19, 2015

$4.18

+4.76%

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Transcript

Operator

Operator

Good morning ladies and gentlemen. At this time, we would like to welcome everyone to Cosan's 2014 Results Conference Call. Today with us we have Mr. Marcos Lutz, CEO; Mr. Marcelo Martins, CFO and Investor Relations Officer; and Mr. Guilherme Machado, Investor Relations Manager. We would like to inform you that this event is recorded and all participants will be in a listen-only mode during the company's presentation. After Cosan's remarks, there will be a question-and-answer session for industry analysts. At that time, further instructions will be given. [Operator Instructions] The audio and slideshow of this presentation are available through live webcast at ir.cosan.com.br. The slides can also be downloaded from the webcast platform. Before proceeding let me mention that forward-looking statements will be made under the Safe Harbor of the Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1996. Forward-looking statements are based on the beliefs and assumptions of Cosan's management, and on information currently available to the Company. They involve risks, uncertainties and assumptions because they relate to future events and therefore depend on circumstances that may or may not occur in the future. Investors should understand that general economic conditions, industry conditions and other operating factors could also results to differ materially from those expressed in such forward-looking statements. Now, I will turn the conference over to Mr. Martins. Sir, you may now begin your conference.

Marcelo Martins

Analyst

Good morning. I would like to start the call today just explaining how we're going to structure the presentation. As a function of the spin-off of the logistics business that took place in October of 2014, we will now - from now on present the results of Cosan S.A. and Cosan Logística separately. For future calls we're going to keep doing that and we should also add a short presentation for Cosan Limited as well. Comgás will continue to have its conference call done separately which was the case this time again as we had it yesterday. I would like to start presentation where the comparison between the guidance and the actual 2014 numbers for the different business lines. We were very much inline with the guidance we provided to the market with only one exception which was the EBITDA for Cosan Lubrificantes which was R$103 in comparison with a range of 110 and 140 presented in the guidance. We have also decided not to present at this point in time the results for the Raízen Energia for sugar and ethanol business for one simple reason. We have here the guidance for the crop year which will end in this month of March. So as soon as we have the results for the crop year for Raízen, we will present the performance of the business and compare with guidance provided to the market previously. Other than that, I think it's - I would highlight the EBITDA for Cosan consolidated which was R$4,047 million. The EBITDA for - you know these type of challenges we have this year in connection with the lack of transportation provided by ALL ended up having an EBITDA of R$304 million and I think on the R$2.1 billion of EBITDA and Comgás R$1.435 billion of EBITDA.…

Operator

Operator

[Operator Instructions] Our first question comes from Gustavo Allevato, Banco Santander.

Gustavo Allevato

Analyst

Good morning guys and thanks for questions. I have one question regarding your spin-off of the gas distribution business. If you guys could provide an update on the spin-off, I hope, thank you.

Marcos Lutz

Analyst

Gustavo, we will start operating I mean in April as we announced to the market as if that business was already separated. But we are not going to do it up until we are able to refinance the prep, because we have already promised to the market that that debt should be contributed to the gas distribution business. So whenever we think that conditions are adequate for us to refinance that debt, we basically move that part of the debt of the company to the gas distribution business and implement the spin off. I can tell you when it’s going to happen, we believe that if market conditions improve, we should do it in the second half of 2015 but we have to see how market conditions will keep evolving over time to see if we’re going to get there.

Gustavo Allevato

Analyst

Okay. Thank you.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from Josephine Shea with Hartford Investment.

Josephine Shea

Analyst · Hartford Investment.

Good morning. Could you perhaps give a little bit more color around hedging, to understand that correctly that on an annual basis you hedge the interest and maybe also principal of whatever debt is maturing?

Marcos Lutz

Analyst · Hartford Investment.

It's both principal and interest for the prep and also for the debt in Raízen that matures after three years.

Josephine Shea

Analyst · Hartford Investment.

And also all U.S. dollar coupon payment of the total of Holdco?

Marcos Lutz

Analyst · Hartford Investment.

Yes.

Josephine Shea

Analyst · Hartford Investment.

Okay. And could you potentially give a little color around what the foreign exchange the reis decline has on your financials, maybe like how much capital expenditure is actually U.S. dollar? Maybe cost of goods sold, revenues their multiple transmission mechanisms of the reis, could you give some color where is the upside and where it is a potential benefit, thanks?

Marcos Lutz

Analyst · Hartford Investment.

The upside is substantially higher than the downside. On the cost side, fertilizer is the main item for Raízen Energia here and honestly I think in comparison with the overall profit of the company, it's fairly small and if you will -- I think yes, diesel which is the raw material for the production of lubricants, which should have a negative impact as it had for the business. What you saw this year in 2014 is a very good reflection of what sort of impact the FX devaluation could have on the business. I think the lubricants I think is the business that is the most exposed and overall in terms of cost, we shouldn’t be very concerned because there is no relevant impact coming from that devaluation.

Josephine Shea

Analyst · Hartford Investment.

And then the last question potential electricity rationing and/or water rationing is there an impact? Should we be concerned or how will you deal with it going forward?

Marcos Lutz

Analyst · Hartford Investment.

Water rationing has an impact on Comgas and on the revenues of the company because we used gas in Brazil for water heating mainly and for cooking. So whenever there is water rationing, people are going to either use last water released -- the usage of water and that should have an impact. If you look at what happened last year in the peak of the rationing basically took place in the last quarter and some in the beginning of 2015 as well, but you will notice that the impact was not very relevant. So this is basically where the bulk of the impact will be basically felt. It's in Comgas and my team is telling me here that it was roughly 6% of the impact on the residential revenue. So we have a 6% reduction in terms of volume in the residential market segment.

Josephine Shea

Analyst · Hartford Investment.

Great. Thank you.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from [indiscernible] with Brasil Plural.

Unidentified Analyst

Analyst

Hello. Good morning. Thanks for the questions. I have two questions concerning ALL and Rumo merger. First of all, I would like to know if there is any specific date for the customers to report the consolidated balance sheet and if you couldn’t state us about an idea, which is going to be the recurring maintenance cash collateral about additional provisions or change that could be relevant for us that would be great, that is the first question. And the second question concerning ALL's rate concession renewals, if they take too long to be accrued, [indiscernible] investments of the expansions brand before the renewal is granted and if this is the case, do we think that these investments could be included in the investment amount that will be required in exchange for the concession renewals, that's it. Thank you.

Marcos Lutz

Analyst

Well on the investments and the concession, let me just give you a flavor on that. We do have an 18-month plan that is actually starting now, that is to be done no matter what happens on the regulator side, okay. So this is basically putting together a management system putting together different approach in terms of procedures and then the areas revising the weekly order operating manuals of the various systems on the rail operation, which I think that's correcting some maintenance backlog that is critical at this point. I think like that, we will be done on the next -- on the 18 months that comes no matter what. This in our view will bring good results anyhow and they're -- look they're not - I mean they’re not a bulk of the investment for sure. This is a number that fits into current budget and I think that's fine. We do expect to have in those 18 months the renewal granted somehow. And that discussion will be based on level of service, size, growth and capacity and things like that. So if I could this with less money, this will be granted anyway. So the number in terms of reis is not what the regulator wants. The regulator wants to really have the service provided at the right level of [obviously] reliability. We have the proper growth of capacity with the systems in place to avoid minimum level of accidents and things like that. So, our very operational KPIs that will be based in the discussion of removing the concession remembering that the current concession already provides on the current contract that we do have the right to once remove the contract for another 30 years. And we also remembering you that Rumo -- line is already 90 year concession - nine zero, so we’re talking about the rest okay. So having said that, going to your first question, yes there is a recurring CapEx on a real operation of this size. Now our view is on the range of Raízen, little less probably like 800. And so this is probably what we will see on the long run on these operation, okay.

Guilherme Machado

Analyst

Just to answer your first question, you should expect us to start basically releasing earning for the combined entities in the second quarter of 2015, which basically means next quarter.

Unidentified Analyst

Analyst

Okay, that's great. Thank you very much.

Operator

Operator

[Operator Instructions] This concludes the question-and-answer session for investors and analyst. Sir you may now proceed.

Marcos Lutz

Analyst

Okay, thank you very much. And we'll be in touch with you again as soon as we have news from ALL or in the next conference call. Thank you.