Earnings Labs

Golden Entertainment, Inc. (GDEN)

Q1 2008 Earnings Call· Tue, May 20, 2008

$28.69

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Transcript

Operator

Operator

Good day, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to the First Quarter 2008 Lakes Entertainment, Incorporated Earnings Conference Call. My name is Jasmine and I will be the operator for today. At this time, all attendees are in a listen-only mode. We will conduct a question-and-answer session towards the end of this conference. (Operator Instructions). I would now like to turn the presentation over to your host for today’s call, Mr. Tim Cope. You may proceed, sir. Timothy Cope – President and Chief Financial Officer: Thanks Jasmine. Good afternoon, and welcome to Lakes Entertainment’s first quarter 2008 earnings conference call. On the call with me is Lyle Berman, Lake’s Chairman of the Board and Chief Executive Officer. As we begin our prepared remarks, I’d like to remind everyone that this call may contain forward-looking statements within the meaning of the Federal Securities law, including statements regarding business strategies, and their intended results, and similar statements concerning anticipated future events and expectations that are not historical facts. These forward-looking statements are made pursuant to the Safe Harbor provisions of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. These statements do not guarantee future performance and therefore undue reliance should not be placed upon them. Lyle will begin our discussion today with a general overview and update on our casino projects. I will then discuss the fourth quarter financial results and recent business events and then we’ll conduct a question-and-answer session. Lyle? Lyle Berman – Chairman and Chief Executive Officer: Thank you, Tim, and welcome everyone to the Lakes’ first quarter 2008 earnings call. Our first quarter was initially hampered by severe weather in Michigan, but we believe that significantly improved results in the second half of the quarter show that the Four Winds Casino Resort, which we manage on behalf of the…

Operator

Operator

(Operator Instructions). And your first question comes from James Kayler. You may proceed.

James Kayler

Analyst

Hey guys. How are you doing?

Lyle Berman

Analyst

Good James.

James Kayler

Analyst

Good. Can you – obviously, Pokagon is doing well and continues to ramp up and the occupancy is very high. Can you talk about future expansion plans and sort of what restraints you have, given the capital structure, when you could start on something?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

Sure, I can speak to that. We are in discussions with the tribal leaders and tribal government there. We have enlisted the aid of outside development companies including our own development firms and we are looking at various alternatives there. I think one of the main things we have all come to agreement on additional rooms would be a plus for that property. In terms of the financial ability to do it, as you are well aware with the bond covenants in place, nothing can really take place until after the first 12 years of operations and certain covenant tests are met at that point in time…

Lyle Berman

Analyst

Excuse me. 10, 12 months. You said 12 years.

Timothy Cope

Analyst

I am sorry, 12 months. 12 years, we will have a big project by then, yeah 12 months. And then obviously after the covenant tests are met and then that will determine how much more additional debt can be incurred.

James Kayler

Analyst

Okay. And the – is there any update on the Shingle Spring compact?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

There is nothing new to report at this point in time. Tribal leadership and their advisors are in constant communication with the Governors' office, there is nothing new at this point to discuss.

James Kayler

Analyst

Okay. And given that the openings coming up sooner, at what point do you have to decide on Class II or Class III machine?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

Well, pretty soon. We have been meeting with gaming vendors on a regular basis. I think internally we are looking towards over the next three to four weeks, we are going to have to make a decision at least getting boxes in the manufacturing process and then that will give us enough lead time to make sure to, like I said the box themselves are being built and then the software, hopefully we can still make a decision on Class II versus Class III on a timely basis.

James Kayler

Analyst

Okay. Thank guys.

Operator

Operator

And your next question comes from Todd Eilers. You may proceed.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

Hi guys. How are you?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

Hey Todd.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

Just a couple of questions. First on the Ohio project, can you give us an indication of how much you plan to spend on that at this point in time?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

At this point, I guess, it's fair to say we don’t know for sure because it's going to have a great deal to do with what our poll say both initially at the end of July when we start looking because we are doing a small introductory campaign right now. Also it would be how much advertising and money is raised by the forces that don’t want this to happen. That’s why we gave you – we can't say for sure, but we gave you a little bit of guidance on what the previous people spent on their campaign.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

Okay. And then, how about maybe for this next quarter, would you anticipate a similar amount that you spend in the first quarter? Can you maybe help us out since that’s a little bit more near-term?

Lyle Berman

Analyst

Yes, I think that we -- Tim, I believe we've announced how much we are going to spend through July, is that correct?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

I think we are estimating that approx total all in including what we have already announced this quarter, about $8 million roughly through to get us through first part of August.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

Okay. And then all of those expenses will show up in your SG&A line, is that correct?

Lyle Berman

Analyst

Yeah, that’s correct.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

Okay.

Lyle Berman

Analyst

Yeah, there will be an operating expense.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

Okay. Let's see -- can you also -- just moving on, can you, Tim, in the past I think you give the market value of the notes based on project. Can you do that?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

Sure, I can do that. The face value at Jamul at the end of the quarter was about 44 million, Shingle Springs 70, and the Iowa project of 5 approximately that gets us to the 119 million we discussed.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

Okay. And then, can you give – I don’t believe I heard it, but can you give stock-based comp for the quarter?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

That was not – it was probably approximately 200,000.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

Okay. And then, let's see, in terms of – you guys provide management fees kind of lumping both projects in together, obviously Pokagon is the larger there. In the past, you've kind of indicated that the revenue coming out of Oklahoma has kind of been in that 400,000 to maybe 450,000 range per quarter. Is that still tracking in that range, has that increased – it sounds like that that project continues to or that casino continues to grow its revenues so, are those management fees increasing for you? I am just trying to back in to what you are getting from Pokagon?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

Yeah, I know what you are trying to do. But – yeah, that’s probably a fair statement. I think in that, you know, it’s roughly – approximately 400,000 a quarter.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

Okay. And then, you mentioned liquidity and needs for additional financing that you are pursuing. Is that all just related to the Ohio project? I mean, if we exclude, let's say, you weren’t going after the Ohio project; would you be fine from a liquidity standpoint?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

We are relative – UBS has given us a line of credit of $11 million on the ARSs that they have and that line of credit is adequate for us to get through all of our obligations until we start cash flowing due to Shingle Springs opening.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

Okay.

Timothy Cope

Analyst

Does not include – and that includes the 8 million that we have committed to in Ohio through July, but it does not take into account any monies that will be spent from July – from August on in Ohio.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

Okay. And then, future financing activities, would those be at kind of a joint venture level? I know, you started a joint venture structure there for Ohio with the financing being covered under that joint venture, would it be under Lakes corporate?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

The financing would be advance to that corporation by Lakes.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

Okay.

Timothy Cope

Analyst

The financing is totally the obligation of Lakes.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

Okay. And then one last question if I might. Tim, I know I always ask you this and I know it's always a tough question or tough to predict, but taxes – it was roughly 700,000 in the quarter. What do you expect going forward?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

I think that’s about right. I think that’s an approximate run rate, assuming nothing else changes, that’s about what we are incurring.

Todd Eilers

Analyst

Okay. All right, thanks guys.

Operator

Operator

And your next question comes from Chris Krueger. You may proceed, sir.

Chris Krueger

Analyst

Hi, good afternoon guys.

Timothy Cope

Analyst

Hi Chris.

Chris Krueger

Analyst

I kind of need a little bit of a repeat on the last question, I just want to make sure I understand it. I know on the filing that I thought it was stated that you are lending $8 million to this partnership. But just to be clear, that $8 million will actually be in your SG&A line?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

Yes.

Chris Krueger

Analyst

Okay.

Timothy Cope

Analyst

It will, right. It's known to a partnership but on -- because obviously there is no certainty that the referendum is going to get passed, yet at this point, it is still considered similar to a research and development expense.

Chris Krueger

Analyst

Okay. And again to repeat what's in your stated comments, your estimated gaming revenues that would go to the state was that range 200 to 240 million per year?

Lyle Berman

Analyst

Yeah – this is Lyle. Yes, it would be – again, not going to the state, going to the 88 counties within the state directly from the casino to the county. But yes, we estimate the 30% to be in the 200 to 240 million range.

Chris Krueger

Analyst

Okay. And as far as – how do you go about this, is it a lot like a Presidential campaign or a Senate campaign where you have some guys out there doing some internal polling on a week to week basis or how does that work to gauge?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

It works exactly the same as the Presidential. We run our campaign and we then take polls. We will continue to take polls by geographic area to see where we need to spend more or less money, and quite frankly also we will be looking at polls to determine what message we should send. The messages that we send in the southern part of the state where the casino will be located might be different than where it is in the north where the casino won't be as close.

Chris Krueger

Analyst

Okay. In your understanding of previous efforts, is that an area maybe they were not as targeted as they should have been?

Lyle Berman

Analyst

That is the information we have been given.

Chris Krueger

Analyst

Okay. All right, I think that’s it from me. I will just queue back in if I need to. Thanks.

Operator

Operator

And your next question comes from Clint Morrison. You may proceed.

Clinton Morrison

Analyst

Hey guys. Going back to 8 million you just talked about, is that essentially what you had anticipated at this point spending through August?

Lyle Berman

Analyst

Through July, yes.

Clinton Morrison

Analyst

Through July. And was there any spending prior to the 1.6 in this quarter or do we assume that essentially we got about 6.5 million between now and the end of July?

Lyle Berman

Analyst

That’s right, Clint.

Clinton Morrison

Analyst

Okay. And in the management fees, I think you are kind of saying anecdotally around 400, but I thought I heard you say it was up 29% from a year ago. And my question was, was there management fees from a year ago other than from Cimarron?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

No, a year ago has only been Cimarron.

Clinton Morrison

Analyst

Okay. So that was back and that looked like that was a number over 400,000, which suggested your management from Cimarron this time should have been well over 500,000?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

No, it’s running about the same.

Clinton Morrison

Analyst

Okay.

Timothy Cope

Analyst

As a year ago.

Clinton Morrison

Analyst

Okay. And, as you guys get into the heat of this battle at Ohio, I guess the question is, whatever the number is you end up spending, is it all coming out of your pocket or do your partners end up picking up any of this?

Lyle Berman

Analyst

It’s all coming out of our pockets.

Clinton Morrison

Analyst

Okay. Now assuming we spend our money and this occurs with a referendum and it votes positively, we've got 18 months until we start construction. Can you give us some kind of sense of what kind of expense load, comes out of your pocket in that 18 months?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

Again, all of the expense load comes out of our pocket.

Clinton Morrison

Analyst

Okay. So, how much do…

Timothy Cope

Analyst

Our partners brought to us certainly the idea they had secured options on the land that the casino would be built on and give their full faith and work ethic to work full time on this project.

Clinton Morrison

Analyst

Okay. So, the question is if we…

Timothy Cope

Analyst

All the monies that we expend of course are loans to the project. We get paid those loans back.

Clinton Morrison

Analyst

Even this upfront promotional kind of stuff to get the actual vote is all loaned to the project?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

Yes, but, of course if it fails the project has no money.

Clinton Morrison

Analyst

No, I realize that.

Timothy Cope

Analyst

But if it's successful, all money is loaned to the project. Past, present and future will all be repaid with interest from the project.

Clinton Morrison

Analyst

Okay. And if the referendum passes, we will continue obviously to expand a lot of money until we start actually go out and get the big dollars to start construction, what do we think we spend in that 18 months?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

Well, when you say a lot of money, it’s just primarily architects and engineering at that timeframe. I don’t think we have put an estimate on it yet, but it's certainly nowhere near what we would have already spent to get the project.

Clinton Morrison

Analyst

Okay. That sounds reasonable. Okay, that takes care of me for the moment. Thanks.

Operator

Operator

Your next question comes from Rishi Parekh. You may proceed.

Rishi Parekh

Analyst

Hi Tim. We have been looking at the Shingle Springs webcam and I'm trying to get a sense for what your level of confidence is that this thing is going to be open by year-end, because just by recollection of where Pokagon was eight months before, was supposed to open and, if we look at pictures of there is a Snoqualmie casino that’s supposed to be opening in Washington around the same time. Those both look sort of further alone than Shingle Springs looks today and I am wondering if you could sort of take us from where we are today to how this thing opens up by the end of the year?

Lyle Berman

Analyst

Yeah, I am actually hear that rumble behind me. I am actually sitting at the construction trailer at Shingle Springs right now. Just got through walking the property and I can assure you that this will be opened, highly confident this will be opened before the end of the year.

Rishi Parekh

Analyst

And we are not worrying about having some sort of a piece-by-piece some amenities not others, but you think it gets open in its entirety by the originally contemplated time?

Lyle Berman

Analyst

Yes, I do.

Rishi Parekh

Analyst

Okay. And…

Lyle Berman

Analyst

The webcam is getting to the point where it's just a little misleading because you can't really see what’s going on from that particular angle, we just don’t have a better angle to put it out.

Rishi Parekh

Analyst

And we saw that you guys had hired Peter Fordham. Are there any other updates you can give us about your staffing and what you are doing right now?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

Well, Peter was the first piece of the puzzle, obviously get the General Manager in place and we are excited to have him. He's someone who comes with a lot of experience both in casino management throughout all levels of the casino and plus obviously we worked him in the past. He was our General Manager at the Grand Casino Coushatta for a number of years, a very large project, so he knows how to run large casino and hotel projects and he has had opening experience so, we are excited about Peter. And right now based on our pre-opening timetables, we are actively interviewing and taking applications for the rest of the team get put in place.

Rishi Parekh

Analyst

Thank you.

Operator

Operator

And your next question comes from [Pat McDavis]. You may proceed.

Pat McDavis

Analyst

This is for Lyle Berman. I had the pleasure of meeting you when you were in Texas, at a meeting with Crandall Addington, Clonie Gowen, Erick Lindgren attended. I have two questions. The number, it involved WPTE, I believe that I am pronouncing it correctly, you have got a new company I think Cryptologic to develop the software and I was wondering how that software compares with Full Tilt and when it should be live and you all are taking bets from poker players online again?

Lyle Berman

Analyst

Well, Cryptologic of course is not new, they have been in this business for quite some time, they are new to us. But prior to WPTE engaging them to run the site for us, they have been added for a number of years and have been running at other people. If you want to compare it to Full Tilt, I would say that it's not as good as Full Tilt today. There are a number of efforts. I think what we call the next releases to make it so. I would say a Full Tilt of 10, I am going to just give a kind of just like may be a 7 and I think within the next 12 months it should be equal or better than Full Tilt.

Pat McDavis

Analyst

And my second question, I guess it's kind of loaded, but when – I have been owning this stock for quite some time, when do you expect to be profitable?

Lyle Berman

Analyst

I think it's only fair to say that World Poker Tour's conference call, I think was yesterday, and this is a Lakes one, but of course we are very intimidated. We have not predicted a profitability for it at this point, but we certainly have predict shown to -- Steve Lipscomb talked yesterday on the conference call and talked about all of the efforts that are going forward to monetize the brand and I think probably it would be best at this point to actually to refer you to his conference call yesterday and you can, if not – if you don’t have access to it, just e-mail me at lberman@lakesentertainment.com and I will give you the call in number that you can hear it there.

Pat McDavis

Analyst

And what about Lakes?

Lyle Berman

Analyst

Wouldn’t we expect to be profitable?

Pat McDavis

Analyst

Yes.

Lyle Berman

Analyst

We expect to be profitable next year in 2009.

Pat McDavis

Analyst

Thank you so much.

Operator

Operator

(Operator Instructions). And you have no questions at this time, I would like to turn it back to management.

Lyle Berman

Analyst

Well, we thank you all for joining us. We are very excited about the casinos that we are running, the casino we are about to run in Sacramento, and of course our effort in Ohio is a major effort on our part. We think we gave you some very interesting arguments we think and quantified why we believe we will be successful. With that, thank you very much and we look forward to you next quarter. Tim?

Timothy Cope

Analyst

Thank you everybody for joining us.

Operator

Operator

Thank you for attending today’s conference. This concludes your presentation. You may now disconnect. Good day.