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IRSA Inversiones y Representaciones Sociedad Anónima (IRS)

Q4 2024 Earnings Call· Wed, Sep 4, 2024

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Transcript

Santiago Donato

Management

Good morning, everyone. I'm Santiago Donato, Investor Relations Officer of IRSA, and I welcome you to the Fiscal Year 2024 Results Conference Call. First of all, I would like to remind you that both audio and a slideshow may be accessed through company's Investor Relations website at www.irsa.com.ar by clicking on the banner webcast link. The following presentation and the earnings release are also available for download on the company website. After management remarks, there will be a question-and-answer session for analysts and investors. If you want to make a question, please use the chat. Before we begin, I would like to remind you that this call is being recorded and the information discussed today may include forward-looking statements regarding the company's financial and operating performance. All projections are subject to risks and uncertainties and actual results may differ materially. Please refer to the detailed note in the company's earnings release regarding forward-looking statements. I will now turn the call over to Mr. Matias Gaivironsky, CFO.

Matias Gaivironsky

Management

Thank you Sandy. Good morning everyone and thank you for joining us today. This was a special year with two different, very different moments. The first one was from July to December with a very high levels of consumption and acceleration of the inflation, and the second since Milay [ph] took office with a radical change in all the government policies where we saw this acceleration of consumption. Although the volatility of the year, we were able to achieve very good numbers, basically in our rental adjusted EBITDA, we reached a level of ARS171 billion that was 8.8% above the same numbers of the previous year. Regarding our net income, we posted a loss of ARS23 billion. That I will explain later, but it's mainly related to the exposure of the fair value of our investment properties, it's a non-cash effect that the change in the macroeconomic generated. So the volatility and losses in that line. Also, we saw the year with very good levels of occupancy in both in offices, malls and hotels. There was a strong activity in real estate projects and transactions during the year where we sold some projects and we acquired and launched new projects that Jorge will explain later. Also during the year we were very aggressive, distributing dividends and buying back shares. We paid ARS119 billion in two tranches. The first tranche represented a yield of 13% and the second one a dividend yield of 7%. And also during the year we bought shares for 4% of the total outstanding shares. Now let me introduce Santiago Donato, our IRO, to follow the presentation.

Santiago Donato

Management

Thank you, Matias. Well, here we can see some figures, some indicators for the shopping malls during the last year and an evolution of our tenant real sales and occupancy as well. Well, fiscal year 2024 ended slightly below 2023. This is in local currency, adjusted by inflation, just 4.5% below, mainly due to a first half of consumption growth, followed by a second half of contraction due to the acceleration of inflation and its impact on real wages and economic activity. This was driven by the change of government in the middle of the fiscal year in December. But we are closing a good year when last year was record in sales. Remember that there was a boost while the inflation generates an acceleration of consumption as well. So 2023 was a record and we are almost in the same levels adjusted by inflation. So the year ended very well and we are start to see some signs of slight recovery in recent months in August, mainly so we hope in 2025 we can keep growing in terms of sales in shoppings, capturing inflation and maintaining occupancy, and also growing in terms of flow of visitors. 98% occupancy is our historical record levels. So we could even in these six months of this acceleration or contraction of consumption in Argentina, we kept the shoppings, with all the brands and full occupied. Moving to offices. Well we kept selling some additional assets during the last fiscal year, as we have been doing in the last four since 2020. This year we sold Suipacha building. This was in the first quarter of the year and three floors of 200 [ph] Della Paolera. So we currently manage almost 59,000 square meter. We sold 15 during the period and we consolidate mostly in…

Jorge Cruces

Management

Well, good morning, everybody. It's been an intensive year regarding acquisitions and swaps and sales. On July 2024, we sold the Maple building, which was vacant at the time. It's a Class B building acquired by IRSA in 1991. Seven office floors and 62 parking spaces with a gross leasable area of around 11,500 square meters. The price was ARS6,750,000. ARS3 million were paid in cash and ARS750,000 in office units in a building nearby on Cordoba Avenue, right in front of our hotel at [Indiscernible]. Gross Leasable Area of what we are received, around 150 square meters. Then we sold -- on August 31, we sold our 50% of our shareholding in Quality Invest. Quality Invest owns a property located in the city of San Martin, which was formerly the site of American British Tobacco, the industrial plant. It has a total area of 160,000 square meters and a current built up area of around 80,000 square meters. The transaction amount was ARS22,900,000, of which ARS21,500 million was collected upon the transfer of shares and the balance of ARS101.4 million will be paid in three years. We, we had acquired a land in Ezpeleta when we sold the Republic building. We acquired that land for ARS60 million. And now we made a batter agreement for ARS16.4 million with the people who had developed Quilmes. And this is going to, this is now it's going to be Nuevo Quilmes dos or 2. Through this barter, we are receiving 125 single family lots and 40% of the multifamily lots. The construction works have started. The trust has sold most of its single family lots. So we are starting to sell family lots next October. La Plata building, while we were part of the investors who are part of the trust, mostly…

Matias Gaivironsky

Management

Thank you, Jorge. Regarding our investment in Banco Hipotecario, remember that we control 29% of the shares and we have a very good year. The results that Banco Hipotecario generated two years reached almost ARS30 billion compared with ARS11 billion last year. We saw a very good evolution of the shares in the market from ARS46.9 last September to the current ARS407. The market cap or the market value of Banco Hipotecario two years today is around $USD138 million, so recover significantly since last year. Also, the bank distributed dividends for first time in the last several years. We received at levels of fierce, we received ARS13.6 billion. Banco Hipotecario distributed a total amount of ARS45.6 billion. The bank is in very good shape. Very good numbers reaching good levels of return on equity or return on assets. The liquidity levels are in very good levels. The non-profitable losses, sorry, the non-performing losses also are in very low numbers. So we are very happy with the evolution of operations of Banco Hipotecario. And also there's something that was a game changer for real estate this year. That was the launching of new mortgages. Mortgage loans to the public. The Banco Hipotecario was the first bank to launch lines of new lines of credit. Then around most of the banks in Argentina also followed Banco Hipotecario and started to announce new lines. That started to happen. Still some process and it's not so fast, but. But there are many banks that today are offering mortgages to the public. That we believe that, that together with the fiscal amnesty that the government is implementing, that can boost real estate definitely. If you go to the next page, we can see regarding our financial results. We started with to see what happened with…

Operator

Operator

[Operator Instructions] Here we have some questions in the chat. The first one from Martina Mertens of Latin Securities.

Santiago Donato

Management

The Urban Planning Code in the city of Buenos Aires is currently being reviewed. How do you think this situation will develop and what impact could it have on your projects? I think this is for you. Jorge.

Jorge Cruces

Management

Well, the mayor, well, when he was during the election, he talked a lot about this. So I believe there should be some changes in the future. Now, the changes he mentioned during the election and the changes we're seeing in the drafts are certain parts of the city that we don't have projects or it shouldn't be a problem for us. But then again, not only that, I don't think that's going to affect us, but most of our projects are already approved. These are for new projects. The changes are going to be for the new projects and most of our projects already approved. So it shouldn't be a problem for us. But I do believe there's going to be a new city plan program.

Martina Mertens

Analyst

Here we have another question regarding Costa Urbana. If IRSA will join national investors or foreign investors or IRSA will look for financing for development alone.

Matias Gaivironsky

Management

First of all, we have to change the name. We are confusing a little. Investors we used to call Costa Urbana and today is Ramblas. Ramblas El Plata is the final commercial name of the project. So we are very happy to announce the name and start the commercialization. As we always mentioned, this is a huge project. It's not today a single project today is like, as Jorge mentioned, 61 plot of land, different plot of land that we can do different transactions, we can develop ourselves, or we can do swap transactions, or we can sell units or we can pre sell units from final clients. So there are many different sources of financing. Probably the most likely that you will see in the coming weeks or months is that IRSA will try to start doing some swap transactions with developers. In that regard, IRSA has not obliged or we don't have to put money because the developers will do the investment and we will receive units as part of the payment. So it's like we will swap the land for final units. We don't think that we will finance this as project finance. It's much more likely that we will finance each plot of land if we need the resources. Definitely we will invest in the infrastructure of the project. At the beginning, we committed to the city to deploy around $USD40 million in infrastructure that we need to start commercializing the different plot of lands. But then I imagine that the financing will be at IRSA level and not at the project level, at least at the beginning. And as I mentioned, we are not thinking in a high exposure at the beginning of the project, since developers will do the work. I don't know, Jorge, if you want to add something else.

Jorge Cruces

Management

Well, in a commercial point of view, we, at the expo, real estate at the Hilton, when we launched the project, it was very successful. People were very interested, mostly local developers. And we are talking with most of the Argentina developers at the moment for this first stage. And we are very confident that this first stage is going to be very successful. And some regional investors are also starting to get interest. So I believe, regarding the question if we're going to have foreign investors or developers, I do believe, but maybe in the near future. In the meantime, we're mostly speaking with local developers and we're very, very happy regarding how the real estate expo worked out. So we have a lot of expectations and we think that in our next webcast, we can be starting to give good news regarding this project.

Santiago Donato

Management

There were some additional questions regarding Rambla del Plata here. If you could repeat the amount of investment of infrastructure in the short term. I think Mat mentioned that $40 million.

Matias Gaivironsky

Management

But it's $USD40 million total investment. It's not in the short term because we have like three big stages of the development. So 40 is for all three stages. It's not only for the first, it's not in the short term. Okay.

Santiago Donato

Management

And here there is a question from George Borman [ph] that what kind of total development capital is needed for the whole Ramblas del Plata project and the time involved?

Jorge Cruces

Management

Difficult to answer, but it's very difficult to answer. Cost in Argentina and construction has changed a lot lately. So we don't know. It's going to be a project that's going to take more than 15 years, probably. So the investment in infrastructure is going to take, it's going to be in those three stages, and we're going to have developers as master developers, we're going to have developers developing buildings in Orland [ph] and we're going to be doing developments of ourselves. So I think that number is very difficult to say at the moment because we don't know exactly how many developments we're going to do by ourselves. But we're going to have a lot of partners. So, as Matias said before, we're going to have different interests in the different buildings with different partners. And so we can't answer that question at the moment. I don't know if Matias, if you have anything more intelligent to say than.

Matias Gaivironsky

Management

I answer to give you some sort of size, this 900,000 square meters cost of construction today, it's hard to say because it's not just a photo. No, it's a picture. When you start, when you finish. But roughly today in Argentina, we are talking about $USD1.500 per square meter of construction. That give you a sense of the total size of the project. But as we mentioned, we won't invest all the money. It will be a combination of different players. But roughly, is a project of more than $USD1.3 billion, $USD1.4 billion.

Santiago Donato

Management

One more questions regarding projects. Manzana Torre 3 when do you expect to initiate to begin the construction works?

Jorge Cruces

Management

The construction?

Santiago Donato

Management

It's already we.

Jorge Cruces

Management

As I said before, we already finished the concrete of tower number three. Well, actually we started with tower number three, but that's the way it's in the. It's in the plans of the city plans. It's called number three. So we already started. We already finished the concrete and we're continuing with tower number three. Number one and two. We didn't start yet. So we're continuing with that construction. Perfect.

Santiago Donato

Management

Then there is a question related to sales, if the company intends to continue selling down the office portfolio. And a question if we plan to hold Banco Hipotecario stake as well. So I think that's mixed answer.

Jorge Cruces

Management

Regarding the office buildings. Actually, one of the projects that we have that I said, it's mostly residential. We're planning and building office buildings continuing in Zetta. So we're going to have more office buildings in Zetta. So we're going to be construction, doing new constructions. Maybe in La Plata we're going to have some office buildings also. But we have only three floors in Intercontinental Plaza. So we're willing to sell those three floors. We still have floors here in Catalinas. So I don't think it makes sense to have only four floors. So we should be selling the floors we have in these two buildings. But we don't have the intention in the meantime, when the short term to be selling Zetta that we have the whole building. So I would say that selling office space should be what we have left in Intercontinental and right here in Catalinas. Regarding Banco Hipotecario. Matias, I don't know if you want to answer that question.

Matias Gaivironsky

Management

Can you repeat the question, Sandy?

Santiago Donato

Management

If we expect to keep that investment, the stake in Banco Hipotecario.

Matias Gaivironsky

Management

Yes, yes, we have it since 1997.

Santiago Donato

Management

Yes, but the late nineties. Good. Then there are some questions coming from an anonymous attendee. I would ask for the future, if you can register so we have your name to be able to answer. But they all are around related to capital allocation. Perhaps Matias can give you some color on what the company expects in terms of future dividends, deleverage, buyback programs. How do you think to allocate that? I think that summarizes all these questions.

Matias Gaivironsky

Management

Okay. I believe that the last three years were very extraordinary years in terms of the capital allocation. If you analyze, we haven't launched new projects during those years, so we haven't started any significant development. The last one was in 2020. We finished in 2020. That was the Catalinas project. Since then we were buying some opportunities in the market, so we bought some projects, but a very opportunistic prices. But we haven't launched a new project that need CapEx or capital allocation. So the last three years we were very focused on our own capital structure, allocating a lot of cash to reduce debt. We saw a huge opportunity to reduce debt since 2020. Today I think that we are very unlevered. So probably going forward we will have a little higher level of debt. And also regarding dividends and buybacks, the buybacks, we are limited by law that we can buy up to certain level of the liquidity in the market. So we have been implementing different programs during the year, but having in mind that restriction. But then we pay dividends to give the opportunity to our shareholders, if they believe that there is a good opportunity to buy shares as well, they combined with the liquidity that we are paying. And again, we feel very comfortable with the level of debt today. The company keep generating very good levels of cash and the CapEx needs are not so significant today. Probably going forward, and something that we start to communicate is that the IRSA probably will start again in a new stage of development. And we have plenty of land available and different projects to launch. But we are conservative in terms of offer and demand. So if we see good demand, we can accelerate and if we see good results or good deals, we will accelerate. But if not, we won't run and be aggressive on the CapEx if we are not sure about the profitability of the projects. But if I have to separate. I would say that probably the last three years were very exceptional in terms of capital allocation that were 100% allocated to our own capital structure. Going forward, I believe that we will see again years investing in new projects, but keeping paying dividends. We like to pay dividends every year. So if we have the liquidity and the results to do it, we will keep paying. And also the buybacks is something that if we see like today, we believe that there is a huge discount in our -- in our shares against NAV, we will keep buying shares as well.

Santiago Donato

Management

Perfect. Well, here there's a question I think Matias have already answered from Esteban, from Balanz on financing and expansion to implementation, to top the global debt market, more or less to refinance debt and accelerate your development projects.

Matias Gaivironsky

Management

I don't think that we will tap the international capital market in the near future. We don't need the size of that kind of financing. International capital market, at least you need to issue $USD300 million of debt. We don't need that. So probably will continue in the local market. The structure is always our structural debt was always in the international market. So we will see in the future if we see an opportunity, but today we don't need it. And we believe that there are lower interest rate in Argentina rather than the international market compared with the size of the debt that we need. We don't need 300, we need transaction of $USD30 million, $USD40 million. So we can manage with the banks and the local market that. But having in mind that IRSA has access if we need to international market, our bonds are. Our bonds in the international market are trading very well. That means that the people like our credit.

Santiago Donato

Management

Yes, well, there are some additional relationship with Cresud. George Cresud is the controlling shareholder of IRSA. Today has a stake of 55.4%. It's an agribusiness company operating in the region and the controlling shareholder of IRSA. And one, the last one from George Bormann is related to the political outlook. How do we see or think Millay [ph] will, if he will be able to bring Argentina back to the forefront where Argentina belongs? That's more subjective, but…

Matias Gaivironsky

Management

It's more personal opinion than a company opinion. I hope to see good, good environment in Argentina. I hope to see a new receiving investment and showing, I don't know, other kind of macroeconomic situation. Last years, the last many years in Argentina were very volatile and very chaotic. And taking decisions to invest long-term capital in that environment is very complicated. That is the reason why a company like IRSA is the main real estate company. Of a country was conservative, launching new projects. So we hope to see a good performance of the new administration. They are putting effort, trying to, to order the economy, to put in order the economy, reducing inflation, reducing the deficit. That is a significant deal and a significant achievement for the country. So we hope to see that to continue. And I have a lot of faith in [Indiscernible]. This is my personal opinion.

Santiago Donato

Management

Thank you. Thank you, Matias and thank you all for joining, for all the questions. We like to be again in the map in the world and having a lot of questions and participation from investors and analysts. So we conclude this fiscal year presentation. We see you next quarter and I will give some the word to Matias again for his last closing remarks.

Matias Gaivironsky

Management

Well, thank you. Not so many more to add. We are very happy with the results. There was good numbers in all the operations and real estate transactions, new projects to launch, very healthy in the financial situation, very active, executing all kind of financial transactions. So we are happy with the performance so far and we hope to continue this trend and see Argentina in a good trend as well. So thank you very much again for your participation and hope to see you soon. Thank you very much.

Santiago Donato

Management

See you all. Bye.