Earnings Labs

RB Global, Inc. (RBA)

Q4 2018 Earnings Call· Sat, Mar 2, 2019

$104.95

-0.38%

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Transcript

Operator

Operator

Good morning, afternoon, evening. My name is Emily, and I will be your conference operator today. At this time, I would like to welcome everyone to the Ritchie Bros. Auctioneers Fourth Quarter Conference Call. All lines have been placed on mute to prevent any background noise. After the speakers’ remarks, there will be a question-and-answer session. [Operator Instructions] I will now turn the call over to Mr. Zaheed Mawani of Investor Relations to open the conference call. Mr. Mawani, you may begin your conference.

Zaheed Mawani

Analyst · Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open

Thank you, Emily. Good morning, and thank you for joining us on today’s call to discuss our fourth quarter and full-year 2018 results. I'm joined this morning by Ravi Saligram, our Chief Executive Officer; and Sharon Driscoll, our Chief Financial Officer. Also with us today for the Q&A portion of the call will be other members of the leadership team. The following discussion will include forward-looking statements as defined by the SEC and Canadian rules and regulations. Comments that are not a statement of fact, including projections of future earnings, revenue, gross auction proceeds or other items, are considered forward-looking and involve risks and uncertainties. The risks and uncertainties that could cause our actual financial and operating results to differ significantly from our forward-looking statements are detailed in our SEC and Canadian securities filings available on the SEC and SEDAR websites, as well as our Investor Relations website at investor.ritchiebros.com. Our definition of gross transaction value may differ from those used by other participants in our industry. It's not a measure of financial performance, liquidity or revenue and is not presented in our statement of operations. Our fourth quarter and full-year results were made available yesterday evening after market close. We encourage you to review our earnings release and Form 10-K, which includes our MD&A and financial statements, which are available on our website, as well as EDGAR and SEDAR. On this call, we will discuss certain non-GAAP financial measures. For the identification of non-GAAP financial measures to the most directly comparable GAAP financial measure and a reconciliation between the two, see our earnings release and Form 10-K. Presentation slides accompany our commentary today. These slides can be viewed through the live or recorded webcast or downloaded from our website. All figures discussed on today's call are in U.S. dollars unless otherwise indicated. I'll now turn the call over to Ravi Saligram, our Chief Executive officer. Ravi?

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Scotiabank. Your line is open

Thank you. Zaheed. Good morning, everybody, and thank you for joining our fourth quarter earnings call. We had a great year in 2018 and strengthened the Company in more ways than quarterly financials reflect. Technology is truly becoming a competitive advantage. We are systematically addressing legacy systems. We are a digital leader in our industry. Our operational policy is noteworthy. We are driving efficiencies with scale, and our data analytic capabilities are accelerating. We have strengthened our core competence of connecting buyers and sellers in multiple channels across multiple geographies and multiple sectors. Let me illustrate, with a day in the life of Ritchie Bros. Take Thursday, December 6th, this was an exciting day. I'm not saying everyday goes this way. But this is indicator of the new Ritchie Bros. On our websites, 295,000 unique users or visitors visited various RB properties around the globe. Many of these users were new users based on Google analytics. These users generated 390,000 sessions. Of these sessions, 54% of them were on mobile devices, 43% are regenerated outside the Mascus, 48% were between the ages of 25 and 54 of prime demographic. The new Ritchie Bros. is not just one father's company. It is also a son’s company and a grandsons company and a granddaughters company. The tradition of multigenerational customers working with Ritchie Bros. is alive and well as we remain passionately committed to deep and enduring personal relationships. At Ritchie Bros. everyday is a new day. Our mantra is move those growth. Take us pass through say February 26, 2019. The number of users jumped to 345,000 and positioned us to 445,000. These are impressive figures and while not everyday maybe like these, the examples bring to life, the power of the platform in domain we are growing our base. Since…

Sharon Driscoll

Analyst · Scotiabank. Your line is open

Thank you, Ravi, and good morning, everyone. Looking at our fourth quarter performance, GTV was up 3%, while we aspire for more, we view this as a positive outcome and are pleased with our ability to navigate tough market conditions as equipment availability continued to be tight in the quarter. From a channel perspective, GTV growth was led by another quarter of strong online performance with double-digit growth in our weekly featured auction. Our live industrial auctions grew at low-single digits, albeit with 15% fewer selling days and 23 fewer industrial auctions year-on-year. Live auction comps continue to deliver well with 70% of our live auctions posting year-on-year positive comps in the quarter. Regionally, Canada led the way with strong double-digit GTV growth with both the western and eastern regions performing well and a notable impressive performance by our agriculture business posting 43% GTV growth. Our International GTV grew mid-single digits led by good performances in the Middle East, Australia and Europe. Our U.S. region delivered another outstanding online quarter, but was slightly down overall. Despite the strong online performance, the U.S. continued to disproportionately feel the effects of the equipment supply shortages as well as cycling a major non-recurring Kruse auctions events from the fourth quarter of 2017. To recap some auction highlights in the quarter. In the U.S., our Fort Worth auction sold $60 million of equipment and delivered 19% year-over-year growth. Our Houston auction posted 11% growth and set site records for bidders and [indiscernible], and our Chehalis Washington auction posted 27 million in GTV and 25% year-over-year growth. Our Canadian team posted strong results in both Edmonton auctions for combined growth of 19% over last year. Our Toronto site continued their record breaking streak in the fourth quarter, selling $29 million, a 36% increase over 2017.…

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Scotiabank. Your line is open

Thank you, Sharon. Just to remind that we purchased IronPlanet in June, 2017 and our reported data includes only seven months of IP in 2017. When I compared 2018 to 2017, I'll provide like-for-like comparisons where possible. I'd like to now spend some time sharing some deeper insights on the full-year of 2018 as we felt it was a year of tremendous progress, and one that we accelerated our strategy on many fronts. From a financial perspective, it was an excellent year for Ritchie Bros. We delivered record GTV touching $5 billion, accelerated our topline agency proceeds up 19% on a reported basis and roughly up 11% on a like-for-like basis versus the prior year. Importantly, we worked hard to drive synergies and control SG&A costs through leverage. Specifically in the second half of 2018 agency proceeds were up 10% on a like-for-like basis, while SG&A growth was up only 3%, which allowed us to deliver a 33% increase in adjusted EPS, all while navigating to one of the toughest equipment supply environments we’ve seen. Let me touch on our key growth drivers in 2018. I'm pleased to say we grew both live and online channels on the unprecedented equipment supply challenges. Our IP weekly auction momentum was galvanized by a [indiscernible] store in the second quarter that acted as a catalyst or deliver consecutive double-digit growth over the last few quarters. And B has become an attractive complement to the live auctions specifically in Canada and international. But the Park, I'm extremely pleased about is that the combined Ritchie Bros. and IronPlanet company. Online pure-play volume in 2018 significantly exceeded the pure-play online volume generated by our tenant in its peak year of 2016 as a standalone company excluding that auction services includes live auctions. Our go-to-market execution, selling…

Operator

Operator

[Operator Instructions] And our first question comes from the line of Michael Doumet from Scotiabank. Your line is open.

Michael Doumet

Analyst · Scotiabank. Your line is open

Hey. Good morning, guys.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Scotiabank. Your line is open

Michael, good morning.

Michael Doumet

Analyst · Scotiabank. Your line is open

Hi, good morning. The A&M agency proceeds rate was down in the quarter. And you provided some comments there, but still much higher than last year's levels. Could you provide some insights on how we should think about that in the next several quarters? Your rate guidance is still unchanged, but were still above the upper range. So excluding the fee harmonization, is there a reason why we shouldn't normalize over time?

Sharon Driscoll

Analyst · Scotiabank. Your line is open

Yes, Michael. So the reason we're reiterating the range is as we grow certain areas of account growth, whether it be strategic accounts, international region, opening up agriculture, and with what we see is kind of the potential increasing risk on the pricing side for at risk deals. We're feeling that that range is still appropriate for you to use to model. We have been above that range as you've noticed, and we will not have an increase next year as a result of additional fee harmonization. So that was a one-time thing, even though it carries on permanently. But we believe that is the right range that we see inside of 2019.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Scotiabank. Your line is open

So let me add to what Sharon said, Michael. First, I think you started by saying agency proceeds was down, so not sure maybe I misheard you. So because the agency proceeds on a like-for-like basis was up 8%, maybe the rate of growth, that's what you were talking about versus previous quarters, which was double-digits, like 10% or so. And look you have quarterly variation, which we say in this business. And to me probably the key driver of why it came off of that really had to do few things with principally I think that we had some inflection on our at risk deals and that had some effect. And look, I have absolutely no major concerns because underwritten business and I think many of you have been sort of critical while thinking we have not pursued at risk deals only to drive ratings whereas we've always said we want to balance underwritten rate and volume. And last year in a tough supplier environment where there's a lot of competition, we were aggressive about going after deals. Now when the market influx sometimes on certain categories or in certain geographies, you will have underwritten results, which you might not have expected, but that's the nature of it. In domain, as I've always maintained over the last 10 years since we are seeing the record, overall on underwritten, they've always been profitable, but there'll be a few contracts, you will not do well or you may lose money. And I'm fine with that because that's what we want to drive and that's our competitive advantage. So I think in domain, now the last thing I'd say is while we don't have a buyer fee next year, I think our supply lose in south, we're going to go back to – I think gradually over the course of the year, volumes picking up and we'll still – I think we're very good at managing at risk. So now we'll go to being a little bit more, hey, as the market influx a bit more careful in that regard.

Michael Doumet

Analyst · Scotiabank. Your line is open

That’s a great comment. I appreciate it. Thank you. And maybe just squeeze in an unrelated follow-up, just on the working capital. That was a cash outflow in 2018. That's I think the first I've seen in a number of years. And you mentioned GovPlanet’s impact there. So the question is, should we think of that as a one-time impact or is there a structural shift there with working capital if inventories may need to rise as a result of GovPlanet?

Sharon Driscoll

Analyst · Scotiabank. Your line is open

Yes. So we did see inventory rise, it increased $75 million year-on-year. The vast majority of that increase was actual normal deal volume, and not related to GovPlanet. There is a minor amount of GovPlanet that is permanent, and perhaps small amount in excess of what that permanent amount is. We've not detailed out the inventory components related to each of those sub businesses. But it's really – I would view it as more of a minor add to ongoing permanent inventory levels. We should be able to see most of that additional increase sell through within the first half of the year.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Scotiabank. Your line is open

So I'll just add something on GovPlanet specifically Michael. One housekeeping note, that we won the award at the end of 2017, but it actually the formal award process took to about midyear or just a little bit before that. And the [indiscernible] stopped sending it to their previous supplier, so they had a massive amount of inventory that had build up, but as soon as the contract were operationalized, they kind of flooded to ask us a lot. And we have to because of the totally new business, we had to put up warehouses, build a whole team, et cetera, cope with this, and clearly it's a different dynamic, but I'm very proud that the team has taken this on. And what we're doing is actually building an amazing new buyer base for Gov. And that buyer base as we commented, even helped us in Orlando, actually GovPlanet now is attracting more users than RB and IP, which is quite incredible, and that spills volumes for later on in terms of acceleration of network effects. As Sharon pointed out, most of the – are a significant part of the inventory was normal stuff that we do. It's just the international. We're chasing some mega deals and we're actually very, very feel good that we're accelerating our international growth and it's becoming the powerful growth engine.

Michael Doumet

Analyst · Scotiabank. Your line is open

That’s helpful. Those are my questions. Thanks.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from the line of Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open.

Derek Spronck

Analyst · Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open

Okay. Thank you for taking my questions. Just to start offset second quarter now where we blocked IronPlanet. For 2019, how should we think about GTV growth? Should we be thinking of it? It kind of in the low single-digit range. And then as the equipment supply, if that loosens up. For 2018, I believe you had a 3% reduction in lots that’s offset by a 6% increase in GTV per lot. If that changes where lots go up, but the GTV per lot goes down. Are you agnostic from a margin perspective on whether you're getting more lots, but less pricing or vice versa, less lots and better pricing.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open

Okay. Let me pass through that because there’s a lot of things from that. I think first as you know, we don't provide specific guidance on specific metrics. So I'd still refer you back to our Evergreen Model where we talk about high single-digit agency proceeds groves to low teens. So that's kind of the range. And that's again on average over five-year to seven-year period. And so to me, the strength of this management team is to pivot depending on market environment. So in 2018, the fact that we got through 10% or so is because of [indiscernible]. And next year volume – will we think volume will be a lot better and so better than the GTV that we have this year. But I can't tell you exactly how much, it'll be gradual every quarter I think it will stop increasing as supply loosens up. But we're pretty confident that we should drive that agency proceeds growth and that's what we're focused on. And in terms of your – the rest of your questions on I think use pay price, but lot went up, but number of lots went down. It's very tough. It's not like we tried to choose it. It all depends on what consignors want to give us. And clearly our sweet spot as three-year to five-year, equipment – heavy equipment, but a lot of times if there's a full to special, they give you a small lots, but for small lots you have higher buyer's speed. So you have to look at this as an overall portfolio. And our job is to take all of that and keep driving consistently topline growth and were quite committed to doing that.

Derek Spronck

Analyst · Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open

Okay. Thank you. And just maybe just moving on to the strategic accounts, are there any big strategic accounts that that you feel is – out there that could provide for a potential opportunity going forward?

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open

Yes. I think in my prepared remarks, we said we had already captured 181 in the U.S. and that's just the U.S. You've got strategic account in Canada as well as in Europe are also making good progress. Just as U.S. alone that team has identified outside of the running, I mean are in addition to the 181 that you universe was about 800, they'd captured about 181. So there's still 600 or so accounts that are on Radar and Target strategic accounts do take some time. You don't immediately sort of go in and get the thing. You have to build that relationship. But once you get it and you perform and do a great job for them. It is a great predictable annuity driven kind of business. Now sometimes they're low rate than end user business, but it provides a very good systematic, predictable flow. So our teams are very, very focused on getting continued to drive new acquisition, customer acquisition, the strategic accounts, but also on the end user side.

Derek Spronck

Analyst · Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open

Some of your new initiative there be asked management, is that helping a sell your services to these strategic accounts and how are you leveraging that?

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open

Yes. And that’s a great question. I would actually have Marathi, who is the guru of RB Assets Solutions to have a quick word on that.

Zaheed Mawani

Analyst · Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open

Could you repeat the question?

Derek Spronck

Analyst · Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open

Just how are you leveraging?

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open

Go ahead Zaheed.

Zaheed Mawani

Analyst · Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open

The way we're leveraging RB Asset Solutions for the strategic accounts is, we have many sellers who are looking for essentially, better data, better tools to help them manage the disposition process. So sellers are looking at their entire portfolio of assets and trying to decide, what is the best possible way to dispose of them to kind of maximize their profitability. And so by us being able to come to them with our data and with our software and essentially partner with them to give them the tools necessary to help them in that process. So whether it's selling on their own, whether it's selling through one of our channels, whether it's selling through their to their dealers privately, we offer a set of tools and data that that basically helps them manage the process and allows us to be better partners with them.

Derek Spronck

Analyst · Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open

Are you offering that?

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open

As directly after there's a number of other callers on the line. I apologize.

Derek Spronck

Analyst · Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open

Fair enough. Thank you.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from the line of John Healy from Northcoast Research. Your line is open.

John Healy

Analyst · John Healy from Northcoast Research. Your line is open

Thank you. Ravi and Sharon I wanted to ask a little bit about expenses in 2019. I know that's been a focus area for you guys and in the slide deck, you guys talk about growing SG&A at a lower rate then agency proceeds. I was just hoping to get more color in terms of those two metrics may trend in 2019 and maybe on the low side and then the high side, how that might shake out from the standpoint of what sort of topline, or volume numbers do you need to get to grow over at the SG&A increase. And at what point does it really select where, maybe the growth rate versus the SG&A level is, maybe more like two to one or something like that.

Sharon Driscoll

Analyst · John Healy from Northcoast Research. Your line is open

Yes. So I'll start and then Ravi can wrap that some additional color, but, certainly, we've learned a lot this year in terms of how to drive synergy through the technology that the IronPlanet now provide to us as well as simplifying the integration aspect. So a lot of the synergy action that was taken inside of 2018 has really yet to show up in terms of added value to providing that scale, so that as topline grows. We will not have to invest as much in costs, particularly in SG&A to support that growth. So MARS is an example of that. The Oracle integration and the finance team is also an example of that. So that's why we’re confident that we can keep SG&A growth significantly below agency proceeds growth for the year. And certainly there is an element of SG&A that is fixed. So as that revenue and volume starts to pump through that certainly will aid with the leverage. And I think we've recorded kind of historical flow through rates in the high 70s in the past that maybe something to look at modeling when we start to get into the higher kind of revenue, the top end of the range on revenue. And hopefully that's helpful.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · John Healy from Northcoast Research. Your line is open

So to add just philosophically John, we have a principle even where we make investments in growth businesses, it pay as you go. So we're not very big on hockey stick approaches, saying, hey, keep investing and some days see the growth. And when we stop seeing it, we're not hesitant like RBFS, when you have had 27 quarters of growth. You are willing to keep adding salespeople because they're just hitting the ball out of the park. So having said all of that, I think we are – philosophically, we are very careful, especially the learnings from 2017 and 2018 that if you have supply constrained environment, you cannot count on growth. Now the way we look at it as plan for the worst and then things get better, that's icing on the cake. So I think we tried to – we want to keep SG&A levels low. I think you've seen total year 2018 and you've seen the second half of 2018. So we’ll let you draw your own conclusions on what this view can drive. But the key is that it's significantly lower. And I've told internally aspirationally that doesn't mean that volumes. So I want to be very clear that we do want to try to get through half the rate of agency proceeds on SG&A.

John Healy

Analyst · John Healy from Northcoast Research. Your line is open

Okay. That’s very helpful. And then I just wanted to ask kind of a larger picture question. I know you mentioned that you guys might revisit some of the evergreen model metrics just due to the change in reporting. But I was kind of curious just your feel on the progress towards the evergreen goals. Are there any of the kind of descriptive categories that you've outlined that you feel better about or maybe a little bit even worse about achieving over that kind of the multiyear timeframe? And then additionally, specifically on the ROIC target, it seems like that, you've made some improvements there over 2017 levels, but just kind of curious kind of what the strategy is in terms of how you kind of get to that 15% number by 2021 and if, maybe changing of – capital returns as part of that.

Sharon Driscoll

Analyst · John Healy from Northcoast Research. Your line is open

Yes, so certainly there's nothing that we're seeing today that would, say that we are not in line with those targets. Certainly our modeling would be volume growth dependence, so those would be the key drivers to both achieve both EBITDA margin target as well as the ROIC targets. Certainly our discussion around, we are looking at the evergreen model is purely the fact that at least three of the measures are really based on revenue as the denominator, and with the inability to refer to agency proceeds on a go forward basis. That's really all we're calling out. We're not calling out any change in our expectations on what the model is capable of delivering.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · John Healy from Northcoast Research. Your line is open

And I think, the last thing is to EBITDA margin, which is the one that we've been very committed to the fact we delivered 35.3 and in the quarter a much higher than that. I think it's just indicative that was – steadily making progress, we remain confidence, and if you can keep that basis, which we cannot talk about that we feel confident that we'll get there.

John Healy

Analyst · John Healy from Northcoast Research. Your line is open

Great. Thank you, guys.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · John Healy from Northcoast Research. Your line is open

Thank you.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from the line of Craig Kennison from Baird. Your line is open.

Craig Kennison

Analyst · Craig Kennison from Baird. Your line is open

Good morning. Thanks for taking my question. It's on RB Asset Solutions. How many subscribers do you have today and can you frame what success looks like in 2019?

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Craig Kennison from Baird. Your line is open

Yes. so on that Craig we essentially you've got lot of this also came from masters and a lot of people, a lot of customers that are using that solution and now we've just added the transactional vehicles to that. So we brought a base there and we're also getting a customers. The key as I mentioned in my prepared remarks is really 15 to 20 reference accounts globally. And I will not look at this as a material revenue or profit driver necessarily in 2019. So that we don't give you a wrong impression. It is more of a marathon, longer term thing. Because once you get in and get these tools into the customers, eventually the big win for us is when they start using that transactional engines and cascade it. And so that's got to be a build over time and we're actually excited about the long-term prospects, but I wouldn't look at it as a huge driver in 2019.

Craig Kennison

Analyst · Craig Kennison from Baird. Your line is open

Thanks. And as it relates to GovPlanet, could you frame what you think of as the long-term opportunity in that marketplace?

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Craig Kennison from Baird. Your line is open

Sure. So we're already, we have the rolling stock with the Defense Logistics Agency, the non-rolling stock, which we just talked about. We have the Marine core exchanges. There are so many governmental agencies in the United States. This is a profitable business. The government loves the team because we had a lot of value to them. They trust us and that's just in the United States and known. So there's so many agencies that we can go and then have the local and municipal state opportunity that we just that team is embryonic, we created team and we're building on that. So long-term, I see this again, it's going to be a long-term opportunity. But I see this as a very potent and possible opportunity, to drive meaningful the topline and bottom line over time.

Craig Kennison

Analyst · Craig Kennison from Baird. Your line is open

Thank you.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Craig Kennison from Baird. Your line is open

Thank you.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from the line Ben Cherniavsky from Raymond James. Your line is open.

Ben Cherniavsky

Analyst · Raymond James. Your line is open

Good morning.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Raymond James. Your line is open

Hello, Ben.

Sharon Driscoll

Analyst · Raymond James. Your line is open

Good morning.

Ben Cherniavsky

Analyst · Raymond James. Your line is open

Ravi you and I have talked quite a bit of in the past about the managing the GTV up through both channels and not trading one for the other. And so there was one comment in the press release that I wanted to ask you about because you mentioned that $829 million of online full-year GTV was generated last year, which was quite a bit higher than IronPlanet's last year as a standalone company, which is encouraging to see obviously. But if you subtract that from the total GTV, it suggests that your live auction GTV last year was about 15% loss than what Ritchie's was as a standalone in 2016. So I just wonder if you can comment on that if I'm thinking about that the right way or what the different moving parts of that look like?

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Raymond James. Your line is open

Yes, I think so the comparison to me, the more relevant from right now, and I understand how you would look at that 1,000 folks set the premise that we have been in a very supply constraint environment then no matter what I say will be very tough to believe that we have it in an extraordinary in 2017 and 2018 that we saw a depressed live auction levels in 2017 in the first half even before we bought our own planet. So I think this has been, ultimately, it is all a matter of customer choice. We are agnostic in terms of does the customer want to be on market where you see, whether you want to be on weekly auction or on live. Our culture and D&A is such a legacy Ritchie Bros.’, salespeople have a natural affinity for the live auction and so any concerns and they are the majority on the end user business. Any concerns that there is cannibalization that is the last thing I worry about. Frankly, on my priorities as a 100, it would not even make the 100 about cannibalization of online to life. I think it is really what customers are choosing. It depends on the mix because it feels smaller items, if you want to put it on the weekly auction to get flow through. And then last thing is strategic accounts. So strategic accounts, they tend to be more – their mix is kind of they look at both online and live, the same which was true even when we had EquipmentOne. So I think those – and last thing, we've had additional GTV coming out of international, I said $100 million of MPE in weekly, lot of those are new customers who never wanted to deal with us because we were only a live auction company. So I think we now have all the channels to suit customer needs. And the one thing I can reassure everybody is a live auction company is very alive. We are all very proud of it and that is our core and that is going to continue to be part of our core. And I think you saw an Orlando, $297 million. If that doesn't show love for live auctions, I don't know what else go.

Ben Cherniavsky

Analyst · Raymond James. Your line is open

Is there something that in the online channel? Is less sensitive to equipment supply constraints, like wouldn't those same headwinds of made it just is difficult to get to grow that side of the business or is there some different sort of way that mechanics there that isn't…?

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Raymond James. Your line is open

That’s no. IronPlanet also got hit in 2017 first half as a standalone company. And then we saw it also happened in the second half of 2017. I think the difference is that we are on both channels aggressively going after a new customers and marketplace, he has been a big part of this because as we've said, its – or $200 million brand and in its first year and that's all people who wanted reserve auction, which we never had. Yes, we had EquipmentOne. IronPlanet had daily marketplace, but it was not the way we've now constructed it. That has driven some incremental growth. And when you think about it, while it is, we said versus the peak year of 2016, that's up significantly. The end of the day when you look at absolute dollars, that's the thing you need to think about. So because the base of live auctions is so big, that – I think that has some impact as well.

Ben Cherniavsky

Analyst · Raymond James. Your line is open

Okay. Well that's helpful color. And your right, that was a big testament to your model in Orlando. So congratulations on that could result. Thanks a lot.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Raymond James. Your line is open

Thank you, Ben.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from the line of Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open.

Maxim Sytchev

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

Hi, a couple of quick ones. In terms, Ravi, I was thinking about, equipment loosening dynamic. I mean, do you mind maybe providing a couple of tidbits that are a bit more tangible, just a relative to that you're hoping that, that you're seeing something. Is there any green shoots on that basis?

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

Jeff, you're on the line. Maybe you can just make a few comments, so that we also hear from some others on the loosening and you are right in call pace.

Jeff Jeter

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

Yes. Thanks, Ravi. Maxim, two weeks ago when we were in Orlando, obviously that that gives us a great opportunity to get in front of a lot of people, a lot of our sellers, and I think in those conversations you just get a sense of what we've known is fleets have gotten very large, rental fleets have gotten large. And as new equipment is also loosening up, in those conversations you just get a strong sense that that inventory is going to start to turn this year. There was some of the equipment's gotten older and now they can replace it. They're starting to think about 2020. So they're starting to think about what is the right time to start moving in those assets into the market. We obviously saw a little bit of that in Orlando. As we were up this year, we've seen some very positive comps in the other auctions we've had thus far in Q1. So I think it's just all of those conversations that that kind of add up, we know a lot of the pipeline works completing. We know there are a lot of assets that are coming out of that sector. And so it's really all of these kinds of data points that we add up that give us the – that that enthusiasm that a supply will start, start to free up this year. And look, it will be gradual, I think as Ravi mentioned. But it just feels very different in all of those conversations that we're having.

Maxim Sytchev

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

Okay. That's helpful.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

One thing to add there Max, the one thing we noticed in Orlando, this year which was different from last year. Lot of the OEM dealers were very engaged last year in backing up the pricing, driving it, trying to buy the footprint because of the shortages et cetera. This year we noticed a noticeable absence of that and I think a lot of them are concerned that they are going to get least returns. We've heard of suddenly a few pipeline projects coming to an end, which could bring several hundred pieces of equipment into the market. So I think all of those, as Jeff said, when you add them, I think we do feel that it is beginning to turn.

Maxim Sytchev

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

Okay. That's helpful. Do you mind maybe quantifying as well in your Page 20, that fewer selling days in Q1 2019 versus Q1 2018 is a possible to the quantified on a percentage basis?

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

Zaheed?

Zaheed Mawani

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

Yes. Max, we don't have that right handy with us, but I can follow-up with you, so that you have that information, okay.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

Yes, it is four days less…

Zaheed Mawani

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

Yes. It's not a huge number.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

That is about four days.

Zaheed Mawani

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

I’ll make sure I get back to you with the right answer.

Maxim Sytchev

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

Okay. And just one last one for Sharon. What has changed in terms of the tax rate expectations because obviously before we’re looking for lower tax rate if it’s possible?

Sharon Driscoll

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

Yes, so couple of things Max. First, we did say at the point of the acquisition that we did expect the best realization of the tax rate to happen within the first few years of the deal and that’s really what's been driving 2017 and 2018 rate performance. Now as we get to kind of more normalized penetration of profit coming out of North America, which is kind of your highest tax rate areas, that's what's really driving the growth. Certainly there was clarification on some of the U.S. tax reform that did have some implications to us on what's considered to be, predominantly taxes, which is the royalty transfer pricing that goes into the U.S. But we think that is probably going to be at its highest level inside of 2019 and then should be less of an impact as that region – basically clear through all of it NOLs and get to a higher level of profitability. So it’s really a good alternative minimum tax kind of approach that they put in place. And what we are also seeing is it's not just the U.S. regulations that are changing. It's also of the international jurisdictions that we operate in. And certainly we just see that it is an environment that continues to change. And that guidance, I will point you to the fact that the U.S. tax rate is probably all in about 26% tax rate, Canada is about 27%. And a lot of our expenses are actually nondeductible in region. So travel and entertainment or neither type expenses are not deductible. And stock auction costs in Canada are not deductible. So those are kind of the major leavers that are looking for that increased tax rate in here.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

So before we leave you Max, I'll just give you the exact number on the live selling days, online, it's 49 in 2019 versus 53 last year. And on a – auction it's six selling days in 2019 versus eight in 2018. So let's put some takes, we've added some auctions in 2019, taken out some auctions. So in domain, you come out at four less days versus prior year. Thank you.

Maxim Sytchev

Analyst · Maxim Sytchev from National Bank Financial. Your line is open

Thank you very much.

Operator

Operator

Our next question comes from the line of Cherilyn Radbourne from TD Securities. Your line is open.

Cherilyn Radbourne

Analyst · Cherilyn Radbourne from TD Securities. Your line is open

Thanks very much and good morning.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Cherilyn Radbourne from TD Securities. Your line is open

Hi Cherilyn.

Cherilyn Radbourne

Analyst · Cherilyn Radbourne from TD Securities. Your line is open

First off, having deleverage the balance sheet in 2018, could you just speak to your appetite for acquisitions going forward? In other words, are there still geographies, channels or end markets that you might want to enter inorganically or do you pretty much have the platform that you want at this stage?

Jeff Jeter

Analyst · Cherilyn Radbourne from TD Securities. Your line is open

So let me take a quick shot of that. So Cherilyn, first at this point, we're not contemplating sort of transformative big mega acquisitions like IronPlanet. However we are absolutely open and flexible on tuck-in bolt-on acquisitions which give us expertise in certain sectors. We'd love to find something in agriculture in the U.S. for instance, or build our transportation skills internationally. We are always looking in drive countries to find where's that might either have been a sector expertise or deeper penetration geographically. So definitely that piece is an ongoing thing. It just we need to make sure those acquisitions are value creative and set our value system because there's a lot of regional players that do business in a different way than we do. But we keep an eye out on those and I don't want to rule those out.

Cherilyn Radbourne

Analyst · Cherilyn Radbourne from TD Securities. Your line is open

Okay, that's helpful. If you can, I'd love to get a bit more detail on what you're seeing in Western Canada because you're so dominant in that market place that you'd be very well positioned to benefit if things are starting to loosen up?

Jeff Jeter

Analyst · Cherilyn Radbourne from TD Securities. Your line is open

Give it to you from the [indiscernible] I think Brian [indiscernible] ahead of Canada especially focused on Western Canada can tell you all about his exciting auction we just finished yesterday. Brian.

Brian Glenn

Analyst · Cherilyn Radbourne from TD Securities. Your line is open

Thanks Ravi. Good morning, Cherilyn. Yes, as the landscape continues to shift, particularly in the oil and gas sector across the [indiscernible] provinces through disruption and then I guess some dislocation. We're in front of those customers and those clients each and every day and as we witnessed here this past week in Edmonton. There is still certainly pockets of activity, no doubts, winter work in the northern regions of Western Canada help drive a lot of that. But when it comes down to the root of it, particularly in the oil and gas sector, we do expect a very busy Q2 and Q3 as we head into the summer months. And it's a tale of I guess two countries in some respect where we see opportunity for us in the West to help clients and customers with some redeployment of assets so to speak. We also see pockets of activity, as an example down through Texas where those buyers and those end users are good clients at Ritchie Bros. So we have the ability to reach out. We talked to those people each and every day to help move the product back and forth. So we expect we're going to be obviously seeing probably an uptick in some insolvency play also across the last, and we're well positioned for that as well with our strategic accounts group here in the West.

Cherilyn Radbourne

Analyst · Cherilyn Radbourne from TD Securities. Your line is open

Great. Thank you. That’s my two.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Cherilyn Radbourne from TD Securities. Your line is open

Thank you, Cherilyn

Zaheed Mawani

Analyst · Cherilyn Radbourne from TD Securities. Your line is open

Last question.

Operator

Operator

Our last question comes from the line of Michael Feniger from Bank of America. Your line is open. Michael, your line is open.

Michael Feniger

Analyst · Bank of America. Your line is open. Michael, your line is open

Can you guys hear me? Hello?

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Bank of America. Your line is open. Michael, your line is open

Yes.

Michael Feniger

Analyst · Bank of America. Your line is open. Michael, your line is open

Hey, good morning guys. I might have missed this. Did you quantify the fee harmonization or buyer fee benefit in the fourth quarter? How much did that help the rate?

Sharon Driscoll

Analyst · Bank of America. Your line is open. Michael, your line is open

We have not quantified it. It certainly was a positive impact on the overall rates that would then offset by some of the softness that we experienced on the guaranteed contracts. Right now we have not quantified.

Michael Feniger

Analyst · Bank of America. Your line is open. Michael, your line is open

Okay. And then just, I think this is related to the Evergreen Model. When we look at the fourth quarter results, your profit margin expanded nicely on a year-over-year basis, but it's still kind of below those peak levels we've seen in prior fourth quarters despite where GTV is and rates still near the high end. You guys did a good job in the SG&A line. So just to get back to those prior margin levels, is it really just a question of scale that kind of drives that or is there anything we should be cognizant of what the mix maybe going more online or maybe more international growth or a higher services that kind of changes that profitability discussion versus comparing it to the older Ritchie? Just any color on that would be helpful.

Sharon Driscoll

Analyst · Bank of America. Your line is open. Michael, your line is open

Yes, I don't know what math you're actually using when I look at our Q4 rate performance. I actually feel like we are back on trend to some of our historical Q4 performance measures. And we’re very pleased with the flow through that we did experience in Q4 related to kind of maintaining a low cost profile on an accelerating agency proceeds growth. So again, I think it is a combination of maintaining that cost management focus and that discipline that we expect to incur inside of 2019 and 2020 coupled with that kind of growth profile on agency proceeds that we've called out in our Evergreen Model.

Ravichandra Saligram

Analyst · Bank of America. Your line is open. Michael, your line is open

And Michael, it's very important not to interpret the Evergreen Model on a quarterly basis. I'll be horrified if that's how people are using it because that was the whole purpose was not to do that because we are not giving quarterly values and we’ve in fact said over a 5% in near period average. Having said all of that, Sharon is absolutely right. We actually thought we have terrific EBITDA performance against agency proceeds on fourth quarter and it is definitely very comparable to – if you go back and look at that and you can call Zaheed and he can run you through some of those numbers. But in our minds, we don't know where your accounts are, but it was definitely very strong performance.

Michael Feniger

Analyst · Bank of America. Your line is open. Michael, your line is open

Thanks guys.

Operator

Operator

And there are no further questions at this time. I will turn the call back over to Zaheed Mawani for closing remarks.

Zaheed Mawani

Analyst · Derek Spronck from RBC. Your line is open

Thank you very much everybody. Have a safe day, and onwards and upwards.

Operator

Operator

And this concludes today's conference call. You may now disconnect.